Author Topic: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread  (Read 87897 times)

Boo the Gentleman Caller

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #165 on: May 07, 2018, 09:11:46 am »
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The first demo you guys made captured my imagination with the snow bound kingdom of Zeal. I also loved the magical academy and seeing the kingdom in it's prime.

Yeah, we had kept the demo most intact, but had built out the event just a bit with the Calasparan military units having attacked the school. Later you learn that they had been manipulated, as they'd been told the school was a training facility for soldiers in an effort to train for the war. This was part of the behind-the-scenes machinations to force Zeal and Calaspera to a head in an effort to bring all-out-war.

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You say that it's meant to be compatible with Crimson Echoes but what about with Prophets' Guile? Cause in that it's said by an NPC that Zeal rose to the sky many generations before the downfall of Zeal.

Just a creative decision MrBekkler had made and one I ran with. Even by making it compatible with Crimson Echoes, we never directly commented on events in that fangame. Rather, we made allusions and did our best not to dispute anything learned from that game.

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The demo started with Norstien teaching a class at the academy when Calaspera attacks. They evacuate the school but Norstien's brother dies there. Then he is given a task by the gurus I think, and we had to track down the terrorists. I spent a lot of time exploring Zeal tho. I loved the details like the End of time being based off of a waterfall area near Zeal palace.

Yup, we made some changes here. In the end, we decided that the Gurus knew of Calaspera and were in contact with their leader, a man named Zarathustra. The four were on good terms and, despite hostilites between their nations, freely shared research. We also made changes so the Melchior, Balthasar, and Gaspar weren't gurus yet, just celebrated researchers in their respective fields. They ultimately ascend to Guru-ship late in the game, and are apprehensive to do so, as they already identify that Queen Zeal is growing mad with power and that Zeal was not on the right path. However, they decided to try and stop Zeal from the inside and to use their science for good...

I figured the game was building to the rediscovery of the Frozen Flame and that's why the cold war accelerated. Like there would be a battle over it and Zeal wins, cementing their dominance. Then King Zeal would touch it and disappear as shown in Crimson Echoes.  I guess it could also send Zeal skyward granting his wish for the county before his wife’s greed dooms it. I had assumed that Queen Zeal only became 100% the villain after her husband “dies” and that the protagonists would object to the Calasperans being enslaved to build the ocean palace.

Yeah, the Frozen Flame aspect of the story was huge. It was definitely a catalyst in the cold war. We complicated that by making the Frozen Flame have two arbiters, the two sisters. Calaspera had managed to have the Frozen Flame, keep it in check, and not abuse it's power for generations.

The story went through multiple drafts and the last time I messed with it was in 2014, so my memory is hazy with all the different drafts. Some versions had King Zeal alive, others had him already dead.

I think the last draft had him already dead, the Atash Kadah having been the catalyst that put Zeal in such a bad state (dwindling resources) and they had lost the Frozen Flame after the spell misfired.

Regarding the Frozen Flame itself, there were definitely parallels between responsible ownership of power and abuse of it. Different societies with different values and how they respond to wielding such power. Calaspera used it to be an isolationist country where all the needs of it's citizens were taken into account (food, art, etc). Calaspera was very much a civilization founded on the principles of compassion, the arts, and technology (science) over blatant magic. Zeal obviously used it to essentially subjugate all, and those not needed worthy were not set to receive it's benefits.

On a little side note, Calaspera also interpreted magic differently than Zeal. While Zeal believes in Fire, Water, Light, and Shadow, Calaspera believed in Fire, Water, Earth, and Wind. Combining the two ideologies forms the elemental system we see represented in Chrono Cross. :D

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As for the playable characters, I really loved the 3 we got in the demo. I didn't expect Norstien to become an antagonist tho, I thought he'd gradually learn to let go of his brother's death, become a calmer and see the truth of Zeal Corruption. Only to be cursed by Queen Zeal and thrown into the future by the chrono shift.

The fact that Norstein became a villain was the twist equivalent to Magus-not-being-the-creator-of-Lavos in Chrono Trigger. There were hints, but it was supposed to be a surprise. Once he turned, we would have scene previous scenes play out with some additional context, showing behind the curtains how Norstein had been manipulated.

However, when Norstein turns the party gains Wellsville as a new PC. At first you are unsure how he survived the attack seen in Chapter 1, and even he claims to not understand it. A few chapters later, however, you learn that he is actually a sort of "dream" version of Wellsville created by one of the goddess/sisters to try and right the path that Norstein was setting the world down. This version of Wellsville thinks he's real, and once Norstein kills the two goddesses and try to usurp their powers (absorbed from the Frozen Flame in 3 million BC), Wellsville starts to slowly fade out of existence. Wellsville has a huge existential crisis -- he doesn't want to die, doesn't want to not exist, but resolves to stop his brother. He completely fades from existence, having completed his task, once he stops Norstein.

Norstein, however, is complex. You learn early on that his parents were researchers, and his dad was from Calaspera. His parents studied the life sciences (magical genetics) in a research outpost in the ruins of a country called Scithia, who had been destroyed by Zeal a few decades before the events of this game.

Norstein always had penchant for the macabre, but he saw the science go bad and his parents and all the researchers there were turned into homunculi. He and Wellsville made it out (for reasons), were able to return to Zeal, and Norstein was forced to help care for Wellsville without the support of parentage. He always had a chip on his shoulder, angry at the lot he had been dealt in life.

Norstein, however, believes strongly in the vision of Zeal. He is the penultimate patriot - he is blind to good and evil in the name of his country. Honestly, sort of the parallels we see in modern day America. A willingness to combat corruption and accept evil for the sake of a false narrative of being "on the right side." Once Wellsville is killed, he decides he's going to take revenge on Calaspera. So he works with the Queen with a promise of Guruship should he succeed, and he solely cooprates with the party to find Calaspera and take it down as revenge for Wellsville.

Their adventure eventually leads them to Scithia, where he is once again forced face-to-face with his dead parents (merged into a homunculi due to bad science), and he acquires their science. He turns against the party, is granted Guruship by the queen, and his former comrades are put on trial for working with Calaspera as enemies of the state and traitors.

This is ultimately how Norstein saw them. He saw them as traitors to their country and felt that they deserved their fates (even if he was in the wrong).

At this point, Norstein picks up his parent's research and decides to finish it. This is really when his spiral begins; up to this point he was still wrong, but somewhat sympathetic. He felt he was doing the right thing and simply wanted to serve his country. But he begins to made bad decisions and questionable ones at that. He pays for it later when his science destroys his human body and he becomes a horrible monster.

TheMage

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #166 on: May 11, 2018, 03:05:54 pm »
BOO I HAVE MISSED YOU!

We switched engines which slowed us down significantly, and never really recovered. I have been spriteing and mapping here and there for the past two years but honestly going for my masters kicked my butt. We have a decent soundtrack 20-30 songs, our battle system is beautiful and much like CT's on the map, we have nearly all the sprites we need, the entire story mostly fleshed out- its just the mapping and the coding and leg work we need to do (so everything.)  I think we just didn't have the man power to do it.

With all the graphics and music and map tilesets i'm sure something could be completed, even if its something much smaller. I have the summer off so~ :D

Have some graphics;

« Last Edit: May 11, 2018, 03:10:12 pm by TheMage »

Boo the Gentleman Caller

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #167 on: May 11, 2018, 03:10:11 pm »
Mage, it would probably just end up being me and you.

TBH, I've considered it a lost cause now for a while. I blame myself for the scope creep. Bekkler also disappeared; I haven't heard from him in a year at least.

:/

TheMage

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #168 on: May 11, 2018, 03:12:37 pm »
Think I last heard from him July of 2017, he's been really busy! Hey me and you is better than just me ;)

Then again we could do something new and small for Dream Splash!

Mauron

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #169 on: May 11, 2018, 03:48:18 pm »
Competition! :O

Feeso

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #170 on: May 16, 2018, 11:14:24 am »
I'd help but I can't code or map or anything XD. Only thing I'd be good for is beta testing and maybe helping to write/ revise the story.

Feeso

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #171 on: May 27, 2018, 02:33:12 am »
I actually wanted to ask about the green haired party member from the demo. I belive she apeared in Chronopolis in Lance's Prelude to a Dream Demo. Since I heard that this was meant to be a shared universe I thought I'd ask about that.

Boo the Gentleman Caller

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #172 on: May 27, 2018, 11:04:39 pm »
Taven! So she was an apprentice to Melchior. Her parents were his previous aides and were caught up in a dream dimension, something that is explored in her sidequest in which you must explore Melchior's hidden labs (just as Belthesar had secret rooms hidden throughout Kajar and Enhasa, we learn that Melchior and Gaspar did, too). There were also some hints about the origin of Masa, Mune, and Doreen and what Melchior's "science" actually was beyond the vague "life."

Regardless, Taven ends up sacrificing herself and is the actual person to seal herself in the time loop with Norstein Bekkler at the end of the game. While all the party members manage to escape (Wellsville fades from existence since the Goddess' power's are expunged, Wazuki (and Marge) end up getting hurled into the future (we know they end up in El Nido in Chrono Cross, but where did they end up in the Chrono Trigger timeline...?), Sage (the Calasperan terrorist) ended up getting hurled to ~580AD and is revealed to be the mother of Tata, and Taven is the one who willfully chooses to remain trapped in the Elemental Palace with Norstein to ensure that he never escapes and breaks the seal.

Just as Norstein was eventually able to escape (and his villainous tendencies end up being replaced with jovial madness), Taven would have been revealed to have also escaped in Prelude to a Dream. She would have ended up being saved by Balthasar. He would have caught her with some sort of temporal net, removing her from the time loop of the Chrono Shift, and she would have been his right hand aide in helping develop Chronopolis.

TheMage

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #173 on: May 28, 2018, 05:19:28 am »


CptOvaltine

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #174 on: July 11, 2018, 03:48:33 pm »
What...is this, and how do I play it!

Seriously, this looks awesome! The only help I could offer on these sorts of things would be musical, and even there I might be useless depending on what type of music you're going for!

If there's anything I can do to help make this a reality, then let me know!

EgyLynx

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #175 on: October 07, 2018, 01:11:44 pm »
Ohho... what next...

how that is silence so long?

chrono.source

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #176 on: October 09, 2018, 09:47:51 am »
Aside from coding, what is left to build for the database?

Boo the Gentleman Caller

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #177 on: October 09, 2018, 10:35:30 am »
We (and by we, it was pretty much I) was constantly rewriting the plot. It grew too grandiose. We were also creating assets.

The sad reality is that I think this project is pretty much dead. MrBekkler, the original creator, is a father now and no longer works on it, nor does he come around the Compendium. TheMage is the only one that creates assets, and even that is generally uncommon.

I'm calling it dead. If others want to revive it, sure, but for now, I think I have to call a spade a spade.

TheMage

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #178 on: January 17, 2019, 10:36:50 am »
While we have the whole plot more or less, 30+ songs and most of the sprite assets and chipsets there are minimal maps and no real coding save for the battle system. Our leader has been MIA for a long, long time and Rpg maker XP is something while easy to learn was something Boo and I both didn't have, boo was the writer and I made sprites.i bought it finally but while I've been going for my masters degree I haven't been working on it much at all. A Sprite here or there. I'm torn between steam rolling this project slowly by pure determination alone (I should speed up after I graduate) or putting my efforts into another project with a leader because I make a poor leader.i get stuff done much faster when someone pokes me and asks me how it's coming along vs when I'm my own 'boss'. I know Boo had fantastic ideas for his own project involving a certain blue hair girl and with rom hacks on the rise I'm very tempted to put my efforts into a romhack.

It needs a leader who can make maps for it to revive because I can't make them all myself. I get overwhelmed by maps honestly. I can sprite you anything but maps are my weakness to create a map from scratch- I can't picture it and I struggle. Give me a doodle and I can do it. and i will follow a leader!

Boo you working on any romhacks that need a spriter?~
« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 10:39:18 am by TheMage »

Mauron

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Re: Chrono Shift General Progress Thread
« Reply #179 on: January 18, 2019, 02:25:47 pm »
TheMage, I might have one that will need a few sprites in the future. I'll let you know if and when things progress.

I can help with some map sketches if you tell me what is needed. I can also help with possible ASM hacks and utility creation.