Author Topic: Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...  (Read 1190 times)

Exodus

  • Acacia Deva (+500)
  • *
  • Posts: 506
  • How do we know we exist?
    • View Profile
Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« on: August 31, 2005, 06:49:30 pm »
http://ce.herograw.com/Chrono%20Trigger%20Remixes%20(SPCs).rar

Yes, all forty-two of them.

Un-rar them with WinRAR, found at:

www.Winrar.com

Now, use an SPC player, or use a Winamp plug-in, like this one:

http://www.zophar.net/utilities/download/SAmp303.exe

After unraring the folder, simply open them up in Winamp.

Long Awaited Battle does not work with SNESAmp, due to sound emulation issues.

You can also use one of these:

http://www.zophar.net/utilities/spc.html

Enjoy them.

Geiger

  • Guru of Life Emeritus
  • Chronopolitan (+300)
  • *
  • Posts: 315
    • View Profile
    • Geiger's Crypt
Re: Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2005, 12:45:54 am »
I liked the remixes for:

- Battle of Rigor and Strength
- Corridors of Dreams
- Cry of the Wind (great use of the pendalum)
- Disturbance in the Fabric of Time
- Echoes of Confusion and Pain (sounds like a cross between Space Age Schala and the original)
- Festival of Jazz
- Glory of a Spring Morning
- Looming Death
- Sanctuary of Hopes
- Sonata of Peace, sorta (its about halfway to being a pretty good remix)
- The Immortal Darkness Beyond (did not like how it started, but it got better quick)
- Trial of Desperate Sin
- Virgin Earth

The others either did not sound very different, or I liked the originals better.

Two suggestions:
- While a subtle difference can do wonders, sometimes a more agressive approach is required.  Try some radical changes with a few of the songs.
- Silence is also an instrument.  Dropping out a few beat lines and whatnot can significantly alter the mood of a piece.

---T.Geiger

Exodus

  • Acacia Deva (+500)
  • *
  • Posts: 506
  • How do we know we exist?
    • View Profile
Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2005, 01:25:45 am »
Ick. You didn't like nearly as many of them as I had hoped.

Anyway, yeah, I agree with most of your criticisms.

At some points, subtle changes are really all one can do. For instance, Memories of Green carries only three bits. The way it loads the tempo for the first two bits, not much really works with it; you end up leaving the first two bits alone and concentrating on the other.

A great many of them were terrific songs in the original, as well; I didn't want to differentiate from this too much, so as to invoke a feeling of nostalgia as one listened to the song. World Revolution is a perfect example of this; you don't want to change the feel, but you also want to make it new.

Another problem I encountered is that quite often, there really aren't that many instruments that work in harmony as you mix; the synthesizers were also a problem. Removing them causes the song to lag and skip beats frequently.

Anyway, thanks for your input. I've gotta work on this map now, so the topic's still up for every one else's input as well.

Janus Zeal

  • Porrean (+50)
  • *
  • Posts: 60
    • View Profile
Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2005, 02:49:00 am »
Unfortunately, I'll have to agree Geiger here. While you have some nice tunes, the originals seem to outshine the remixes.

Of the songs I did enjoy:
Battle of Rigor and Strength - Decent, I could swing either way
Corridor of Dreams - Much as I like your version, I still prefer the original.
Cry of the Wind - I thought the pendulum was a nice touch as well, although (again) I prefer the original
Echoes of Confusion and Pain - Nicely done. The best remix of the list
Festival of Jazz
Glory of a Spring Morning
Sanctuary of Hopes
Sonata of Peace - Hated it at first, but it's grown on me
The Long Awaited Battle With a Tyrant

Again, same complaints as Geiger. Subtlety is fine, but often times little is changed in your remixes. Try to differentiate your remixes from the original a little more.

Exodus

  • Acacia Deva (+500)
  • *
  • Posts: 506
  • How do we know we exist?
    • View Profile
Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2005, 02:56:50 am »
Yeah, I realize many of them weren't differentiating far from the originals.

Like I said, I wanted the songs to keep their nostalgic form. Many people who listen to these songs aren't looking for something that sounds unbelievably different, as seen by the many complaints on GameFAQs.com.

I used this little bit of information and decided against massively changing the songs.

That, and the many other reasons.

Lord J Esq

  • Moon Stone J
  • Hero of Time (+5000)
  • *
  • Posts: 5463
  • ^_^ "Ayla teach at college level!!"
    • View Profile
Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2005, 03:54:04 am »
Your only real sin in this undertaking is the horrible, horrible job you did of titling the songs! Man, we’re talking cliché city! =P

As for the music itself, you need to be more assertive with the percussion. What you’ve been doing is leaving all these various drums in the soundtrack, mostly untouched from the original, and this limits your ability to change the character of whatever piece. It also steps over the feet of the reinstrumentations you do make, sometimes. I’m an anti-percussionist in the world of music theory, and I love it when people Just Say No to excessive drumbeats, so you might try reinstrumenting or even completely muting some of the percussion channels and see what you get. And I agree with Geiger: Silence is an instrument too, not just literally (“Silence” is what it’s called in the TF editor) but artistically as well. And that holds true for all elements of a composition, not just the percussion.

Moving on, you make too much use of the Schala Bells, Zeal Bells, pizzicato strings, and other specialty instruments. This is a common mistake among fan remixers, who take the characteristic sounds out of their favorite songs and promulgate them elsewhere. The problem here is that exotic instruments stand out very distinctly in otherwise traditional arrangements, and can contribute a feeling of homogeneity to the soundtrack as a whole. It doesn’t necessarily impact any one song adversely, but the soundtrack as a whole suffers from a lack of dimension. A good piano sample will run circles around a tonally intractable Schala Bell any day. The trumpet and trombone samples in CT are also very good in their sheer litheness. So is the flute.

But speaking of the flute, I notice that many of your flute placements are actually in poor taste. For instance, the flute in “Steadfast and Faithful” is completely overpowered by the accompaniment. The theory is just plain bad. You can’t replace a brass section lead with a single flute. You’ve got to remember that there’s more to reinstrumentation than just a change in timbre. Relative volumes also have to be taken into account. This also applies to some of your other instrument choices in various tracks.

I couldn’t find any of your remixes that I preferred to the original. However, do keep in mind that you’re competing against one of the best video game soundtracks ever composed. Mr. Mitsuda specifically engineered the instruments to do exactly what he wanted of them, whereas .spc reinstrumenters must content themselves with using only what he has already made available. Most of the time there simply is no better alternative than the intended sound. Surpassing the original becomes a matter of serendipity.

“Delight of a War God” was probably the most interesting of your reinstrumentations. If only you could get in there and flesh it out in the areas to where you’ve drawn the attention. But alas! We work within the limits we’ve got.

Anyhow, don’t take my criticism as a personal insult. I probably wouldn’t do any better if I were to reinstrument these myself.

Exodus

  • Acacia Deva (+500)
  • *
  • Posts: 506
  • How do we know we exist?
    • View Profile
Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2005, 04:02:56 am »
No insult taken at all!

I asked for criticisms to better my work. I didn't ask for everybody to be soft so that I could feel better about myself.

As to the percussion, these little bastards can be some tricky suckers to manipulate.

Most of the time, it sounded so terrible that I usually just set them back the their presets.

Another problem that I had was that most of the music comes from my own personal tastes; I hate drums but absolutely love woodwinds.

By the way, there was no Flute used in Steadfast and Faithful.

Lord J Esq

  • Moon Stone J
  • Hero of Time (+5000)
  • *
  • Posts: 5463
  • ^_^ "Ayla teach at college level!!"
    • View Profile
Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2005, 04:08:13 am »
Quote from: Hazy Vision
By the way, there was no Flute used in Steadfast and Faithful.

Is it a piccolo, maybe? That's like Flute Jr.! I'm no Mozart...all I know is that it's not an oboe. =P

Exodus

  • Acacia Deva (+500)
  • *
  • Posts: 506
  • How do we know we exist?
    • View Profile
Looking for some opinions on these reinstrumentations...
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2005, 07:17:37 pm »
Actually, I believe I used the French Horn.