3D Crono Cross model extraction?

[jono]

It seems that he modified the source code of the emulator to dump all the models drawn from a given save state. It would be impossible to do with epsxe because it is/was a closed source project. I'd have a llok if anyone can find the source code to Adripsx and the plugin specified, the only thing I'm not sure about is the re-construction process. I'm pretty sure I'll be abl to find documentation somewhere.

Really want uni to be over so I can have a really good go at this. If you guys know of any other open source emulators that run chrono cross then maybe we could look for them.

[FaustWolf]

Good deal, jono. Maybe during winter break you and Luminaire can take a look at this process. In the meantime I'll be on the lookout for open source emus, as well as AdriPSX.

[Luminaire85]

The only open-source PSX emulators I could find are AdriPSX and PCSX, neither of which appear to have been updated since 2003. After several tries with Google I finally found the source to AdriPSX, but the author must have despised commenting, because I have yet to find a single one. Plus the variable names are extremely generic. The PCSX source is much nicer in terms of comments, plus there's a Visual Studio project file in addition to the makefiles. (Everything is written in C.)

The P.E.Op.S. GPU plugin is on Sourceforge. There's a Visual Studio project file here too. The post from GameDev suggests to me that maybe only the plugin would need to be modified in order to get the model data. Perhaps this would allow us to continue to use a more current emulator?

Just thinking out loud.

[FaustWolf]

Okay, this is a wild shot in the dark, but I have enough circumstantial evidence to suspect that .KMD files might be in Chrono Cross:



That's offsets 1F0320 ~ 1F036F in the iso. As for what .KMD files are, or might be, a thread at the xentax forums indicates more or less that it's model data: http://forum.xentax.com/viewtopic.php?p=19004&sid=faf16ae844b2da1f5ef414c4082c1f7f

This all won't be enough to get me excited until I can get my hands on a .KMD model example. In the meantime, does anyone know anything about the .KMD model format? I'll post an example if I happen to come across one.

EDIT: Eww, but the thread also says that it might stand for "Konami Model." Well, I'll follow this lead as best I can.

[FaustWolf]

Re-creating a post I made elsewhere here, as it is also relevant to model extraction:

In a moment of beautiful, beautiful mental clarity, I re-discovered a .zip file called "cctools" that's been sitting in a folder on my desktop since two days ago. It has a CCP file called "Main Disk Dump"!!  

It says: "Dump the complete content of Chrono Chross CD1/CD2 US and Japanese version"
Then it's got a bunch of Computer Science speak, and I'm an economist, so --

I'm attaching the .CCP in a zip to this post b/c I'd like some confirmation as to whether the code contained within is C/C++ and if anyone knows of a good compiler if that's the case. This might just save us a lot of work!

EDIT: Oh, it is C/C++, I think. Anyone know of an appropriate compiler for the code contained within? If it works, we owe it to Yazoo, wherever he is.

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[jono]

I downloaded and compiled the dump program you found, I've modified it a bit for usability but I have a small problem, it relies on the disc image being exactly 736,651,104 bytes long, I can only get an image of my chrono cross to be 641,437,696 long.

If anyone has a cd image exactly that long, I'll tidy up the program so it's a bit simpler to use an put it up. It's currently not creating directories properly in windows and is hard coded to look for an iso image that is called Chrono1.iso in the sam directory as the program so i'll just fix these couple of things up and it should work fantasticly.

We still have the problem of understanding the formats even though the files will all be output and be readily available.

EDIT: oh I see it's already been done, never mind

[ZeaLitY]

Hm, uploading would take a while...

perhaps something can be arranged. But for now, I'll go ahead and 7zip the two character model folders and pass it off to you. Maybe you can throw it at a program and see if it's recognized.

http://chronofan.com/Black/Cross/DUMP.7z

[jono]

Oh, sorry, I wasn't asking for you to upload the iso for me I'm a little bit anti-piracy so I was just hoping to send the program to someone to rip the files. I'd rather not be sharing around iso's

Doesn't matter anyway, as you guys are a few steps ahead of me

Thanks very much for those model files, I'll have a peek at them now, this is the first bit of free time I've had for ages.

[FaustWolf]

Jono, to get a CD image that's the proper length for the Ramsus/Yazoo dumper, you can rip with IsoBuster and use the settings "Extract CD <Image> -> RAW"

That should give you a 700+MB .bin file that will work.

[Luminaire85]

So if I'm interpreting tonight's posts correctly, then in the file I've attached are the 3D models of all playable characters as seen at the status screen. (These are all the "3" files as produced by Yazoo's cd-decompress.exe.)

I believe this brings us to the point of trying to figure out how the model data is stored in these files.

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[FaustWolf]

Pardon my foolish question Luminaire, but did you produce these files from a single file in the CD directory or did you decompress all of them? *Haven't tried CD Decompress yet; must go do that now*

But to answer your question about the character models, I, er...don't know yet. Gemini tells me in another thread that the model data is only a "copy" of the true model, and not the model itself - I think. It's toward the end of the "FILE EXPLORATION..." thread. BUT - battle/status screen textures are certainly in there, as Gemini has proven. I'm hopeful that the CD directory might contain everything.

[Luminaire85]

I just set up the file/folder structure that Ramsus explained and ran cd-decompress.exe (after running the dump program first, of course). A few seconds later all 51 .out files in the CD directory had a corresponding character-name folder with the six files Gemini mentioned in each. Out of those I only posted the "3" files in order to make the attachment <1 MB.

[FaustWolf]

Aha, thank you. I'll try as well.

EDIT: Luminaire and jono, I'm not sure if having a file header in front of you would help out any in determining whether there could potentially be model data in these, but here goes:

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/9369/possiblemodelske8.gif

The first 8 bytes seem to constitute a header. Any rule of thumb for determining whether there's vertex data or other 3D data stuck within hex code?

EDIT: I'm linking to some documentation Halkun gave us at the Qhimm forums regarding FFVII battle models, which may be at least somewhat similar to Cross'. It might be useful to compare what's in this wiki entry with the (potential) models' headers I've linked to in my previous edit.

http://wiki.qhimm.com/FF7/Battle_model_format_%28PSX%29

[jono]

I've had a little look at these files, again I'm snowed under at uni but I'll try and post later if I find something of interest.

I would have guessed that they are compressed but they may not be. I hope we do find uncompressed model data of some form in there, then a simple model converter could easily by written to output to whatever format is required.

Exciting stuff indeed.

[FaustWolf]

A tip from Gemini in the texture thread:

the drp files *should* (not verified, but it must be like that because of the method used for loading all the data) contain the field 3D model depending on the room.

It appears the drp files in Rooms\Disk1\####\unknown may be some sort of environmental model data.

I believe everything we're producing now is uncompressed, jono. The file sizes for the folders appear to be way bigger than the files from which Yazoo's decompressors extracted them. We're most likely looking at real model data. If you haven't had a chance to rip any of this stuff yourself, I'll gladly post examples of both environmental 3D files and what I think are character battle models (the "3" files Luminaire has already posted).

EDIT: Just for my own notes, it looks like we know of three sources for potential model files:

CD\Disk1\(CharacterName)\"3"
OMCM\Disk1\          (Though I think there's .TIMs in here too; maybe there's no models at all?)
Rooms\Disk1\(Room#)\unknown\

Also, I take back my earlier statement about our files being decompressed. Even the room decompressor and CD decompressor utilities seem to produce a collection of folders that are about the same size as the OUT files they came from; in fact, the CD folders are about 36 bytes smaller in size than the OUT files they came from if I'm interpreting things correctly (with Serge, Kid, and Guile coming from 0075, 0076, and 0077 OUTs respectively).

And I have no clue as to where the enemy overworld and battle models are; maybe in the MISC folder?