Author Topic: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review  (Read 1712 times)

Boo the Gentleman Caller

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RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« on: September 08, 2010, 11:41:29 pm »
RPGamer ran a 10-year retrospective review for Chrono Cross earlier today... Can't say I agree with their 2.5 out of 5.

http://www.rpgamer.com/games/chrono/ccross/reviews/ccrossstrev4.html

FaustWolf

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2010, 12:36:38 am »
Ouch, a 50% rating. Not even brownie points for the game's exquisite sense of atmosphere?

utunnels

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2010, 12:55:04 am »
Most of the points are quite honest, I don't have much to argue, but I just gave it a shrug after reading it over. :P

ZeaLitY

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2010, 02:01:49 am »
Quote
Disrespects Chrono Trigger, its source material



Quote
Disrespects Chrono Trigger fans' nostalgia

FTFY

ShinGundam

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« Last Edit: September 09, 2010, 02:46:08 am by ShinGundam »

maggiekarp

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2010, 01:57:47 pm »
I agree with the review almost completely but I would have given it a passing grade at least

gatotsu911

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2010, 11:22:14 am »
Clearly written by another butthurt Trigger fanboy, but at least he tries (with some degree of success) to appear objective.

utunnels

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2010, 11:26:13 am »
2.5 out of 5, could mean half love it, the other half hate it.
 :lol:

Jutty

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2010, 10:53:12 pm »
I would get upset if I gave a shit about this guys opinion.

Lennis

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2010, 10:59:32 pm »
I pretty much agree with the body of the review, but the final score of 2.5 out of 5 is pretty harsh and just... wrong.  Obviously, CC's faults as a sequel to Trigger dragged the score down farther than the game deserved.

maggiekarp

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2010, 08:36:18 pm »
Cross's plot wouldn't really make any sense if you took out every tie to Trigger, so you can't fault people that much for comparing the two. It's kind of messy plotwise, but a lot of RPGs from that era were. A retrospective review of Final Fantasy 7 or Xenogears would probably mention how insane the plots get at times.

Lennis

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2010, 12:14:59 am »
Indeed, Xenogears was about as convoluted a plot as I've ever seen, but in fairness the game wasn't really finished.  Disc 2 was clearly rushed, ironically to concentrate creative resources on Final Fantasy 7 - if I remember correctly.  One can only imagine how Xeno would have come together in disc 2 if it had had full funding to the very end.

I remember the key headscratching moment in FF7, for me anyway.  Everyone escapes from Midgar and suddenly Shinra is forgotten and the key to saving the planet is stopping a mysterious assassin named Sephiroth.  The plot got better, of course, if you didn't look at it too carefully.

HeadlessFritz

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2010, 12:36:33 am »
2.5/5 is a bit too low considering what he wrote... I think.

There's a very bright chrono cross review my friend found recently. I think it's retrospective too. If you have patience, it's really worth your time. He describes well my mixed feelings about chrono cross. It's not just a review, more like a philosophical text about the game !

Here's the link : http://socksmakepeoplesexy.net/index.php?a=cross

Overall, Cross is a flawed game... But it has so much depth that you want to play it over and over again. And that's not necessarily the case for gems like Ocarina of Time.


Rocky

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2010, 02:04:44 am »
(CONTAINS SOME SPOILERS)

Haven't read the review in your link yet, Fritz.  I will a little bit later.  Just wanted to comment on the RPGamer review first, while it's fresh in mind, as well as share my thoughts on both the game and the review.

First off, the positives (regarding Chrono Cross).  There's the obvious stuff, of course, which should never be taken for granted - the music is, quite simply, phenomenal.  At least equal in quality to Chrono Trigger's music score (sounds better 'cause it's not synthesized, of course, but I just mean the music score itself).  And the visuals are remarkable for 10 years ago - especially the engrossing movie scenes.  But for me, what really shines in this game is all of the emotive moments in the game, mostly revolving around Kid's development as a character.  The scene on Water Dragon Isle where she opens up to Serge for the first time about her 'Big Sis' (which sadly is a scene that can be missed given certain in-game choices) and the scene just after Serge rescues her from Lucca's burning house as a young girl - just very well done, and they truly showed her vulnerable side underneath her rough exterior (and both scenes were accompanied by the music track "Star-Stealing Girl" - very key).

Unfortunately, those high points of the game truly pale next to the key flaws of it.  (Now this is obviously just my opinion - I certainly respect the opinions of those who think much higher of the game.  Really just a matter of preference.)  The RPGamer review said a couple of key things that, for me, hit the issue spot on.  First and foremost, the story.  Story is the most important part of a game (for me), and CC's story just encompassed WAY too much - so much, in fact, that I truly don't think even the game's writers could adequately explain it all so that it made sense.  The whole Time Crash Ground Zero event - though fascinating - is way too complicated and boggles the mind.  And that would still be okay IF the game itself spent a LOT more time breaking it down for us, the player - since it is a key element to explaining the world of El Nido itself.  Hence, the very long attempt at explaining it here on the Compendium, with the all the theories like Time Bastard and Time Traveler's Immunity.  And then the end of the game, rushing to give the player all the last-minute info in a 5-minute conversation.  It's like making a sci-fi romantic comedy with time travel and cramming it into an hour and a half.  It's mind-blowing, but leaves you not understanding how it all ties together in a tangible way.

Secondly, the 40+ characters and element allocating.  Now, the Trigger characters weren't tremendously deep, but they weren't shallow either - and all 7 of them had a unique story that helped you relate to them.  (And you actually got to USE them all.)  Besides Serge and Kid - whose stories were developed very well - well, the reviewer rightly said that most of the rest of the characters are basically just introduced and then never heard from again.  (Honestly - when Poshul pulled a turnip out of the ground, and the turnip joined my party... really?  And then late in the game, on Fargo's ship - "Hey, I'll join!"  "Me too!"  "Aw, what the heck, me too."  "And me, the fourth guy." <-- said in the voice of Zoidberg from Futurama, he he)  Combined with having to allocate a billion elements every time someone joins... it really just diverts much-needed attention away from the already-too-complex story.  I also chuckled when the reviewer pointed out how enemies clearly aren't held to the same rules as the player in battle, and seem to attack randomly and repeatedly with elements without explanation or pattern - I remember thinking that when I played.

Lastly, I had to agree, for the most part, with this quote: "the game's story manages the difficult trick of simultaneously being disrespectful to its predecessor and impenetrably bizarre in places."  And then comparing the story to a Wizard of Oz sequel in which the witch somehow wasn't REALLY dead (Lavos) and killed all the heroes of the original (Lucca, possibly Crono and Marle, Robo/Prometheus).  I know many would disagree, but this is how I felt too.  It's like it undid the legacy of what Trigger's heroes accomplished.  It's like Star Wars episodes 4 and 5 and... then 6 is never made (anytime now, Squeenix) - leaves me feeling depressed over the fates of the Trigger team.

Sorry to ramble on, and sorry if there was a better thread to post these thoughts of mine - it's just that I read the cited review and it conjured up some old thoughts regarding this game.  If the game stood on it's own, I'd probably give it a 3 or 3.5 out of 5.  But as the sequel, I'd have to agree with the 2.5.  And believe me, I KNOW Chrono Trigger isn't perfect.  But at least it was complete, it didn't overcomplicate things, and it kept it to a limited group of characters whose stories could all be told and who could all be used regularly.  You could UNDERSTAND what was going on, without having to fill in hole after hole with theory after theory.

All that said, I can certainly understand why many love CC so much.  It just depends on what areas of a game each person personally values most.

ShinGundam

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Re: RPGamer Chrono Cross Retrospective Review
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2010, 11:02:07 am »
Indeed, Xenogears was about as convoluted a plot as I've ever seen, but in fairness the game wasn't really finished.  Disc 2 was clearly rushed, ironically to concentrate creative resources on Final Fantasy 7 - if I remember correctly.  One can only imagine how Xeno would have come together in disc 2 if it had had full funding to the very end.
To be fair, A lot of games from Square faced a big cut in content (Gears, Cross, FF9, FF10, FF12 and recently FF13), It is just the fact that the modern Square's overall development does not scale up to projects above a certain size. Also, In FF7's case, Not sure what do you want to say by downplaying FF7 either, It was the first big 3D RPG from Square it is far more challenging to craft a new 3D game engine for first time.