Author Topic: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses  (Read 5374 times)

ThatGuy

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Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« on: December 06, 2017, 11:19:53 pm »
So opening and looking at this fan art piece of Zeal, I realized something!

Zeal was thouuuusands of years before Guardia and all that. And it was wiped out, almost totally. People started completely over. So the timeline isn't objectionable, in a way (unlike the 65-million year BC where humans were around), it's just that humanity had to really start all over after that.

Kind of like 2300 AD.

So, really, 2300 AD is similar to 11600BC, or so. I never thought of it this way- but Lavos caused a near extinction event more than once...

...

And now, as I write this, it makes me wonder if there's another story between that 12,000+ year time period. Did Lavos fuck up the world then, too?

xcalibur

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2017, 12:25:02 am »
Almost all the dates in this game have some connection to Lavos.

65 million bc: when Lavos landed
12000 bc: when Lavos punished Zeal's hubris and destroyed their civilization
600 ad: when Magus summoned Lavos to do battle, and was defeated (in the lavos timeline)
1000 ad: not much, but a random NPC mentions earthquakes caused by Lavos.
1999 ad: when Lavos destroyed the world, of course.
2300 ad: The end of Lavos' life-span, and the growth of his spawns.

an important consideration here is the Entity. Robo posits that the gates were created by an Entity that was reliving its memories, sharing its dream with the party, and recruiting them to stop Lavos. Based on this, I would conjecture that the Entity was dying in 2300, it was reflecting on its defeat by Lavos and its impending death, and having flashbacks to the important 'turning-points' in its vast life. I'm not sure of the significance of the present, except that its during the youth of Chrono, Marle, and Lucca, who were chosen by the entity to be its champions against Lavos.

Lavos caused no less than three extinction events. First, his fall wiped out the Reptites. Second, he destroyed Zeal for their impudent act of draining too much of his power. Finally, he destroys the world in 1999, either because civilization has become too powerful, or his biological clock tells him its time to reproduce (and nuke the surface to make it safe for his spawns), or both.

The fact that Lavos destroyed Zeal in particular, and not the Earthbound, is one of the strongest arguments for his intelligence imo. He was aware of the Mammon Machine siphoning off his power, he identified Zeal as the culprit, and destroyed the target that offended him, while allowing a non-magical civilization to develop. This to me proves that Lavos is not a mindless space tick, but an intelligence far above the human race, which he farms as livestock and guinea pigs.

ThatGuy

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2017, 12:06:31 am »
I think the 1000AD mention was of whirlpools, not earthquakes..? Which was a Heckran foreshadowing.

Hmmm... could be that the earthbound who survived did because it was a numbers thing? Because most of them were gone too. But I'd say you're right, he would want people to continue on, because he's collecting DNA and whatever, and thus would only kill the stuff that he doesn't like.

I'd still like it if they made a direct sequel and it turned out that Schala (not Kid) was the entity...

I don't know about the farming vs the collecting though. Did Lavos really influence the evolution of the planet? Or merely observe? We may never know...

Anyway, we could still theorize that he did a Noah's Ark-style restart of things a time or two more.

Mauron

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2017, 12:34:53 am »
There's a line about earthquakes in Truce Inn, but there's nothing connecting it to Lavos.

ThatGuy

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2017, 11:11:06 pm »
What's the line..?

Razig

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2017, 11:52:37 pm »
It's the guy on the second floor of Truce Inn.

Quote from: SNES
Remember the earthquake we just had?

>Yes.
We've been having too many.
Something's wrong…
Hope the "Big One" isn't coming!

>No.
No?
Airhead, huh?
Well, never mind.

Quote from: DS
Remember that earthquake we had the other day?

>Yes.
We've been having far too many lately.
Hope it's not a sign of something bad about to happen.

>No.
You're an oblivious one, aren't you?
Well, never mind, then.

ThatGuy

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2017, 12:24:16 pm »
Oh, right...

That one I thought was a Heckran reference when I first played way back, but now I wonder...

xcalibur

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2017, 09:43:00 pm »
yes, that's the line I was thinking of. it's vague, but it's something.

the important thing about the Present is that it's 1000 years before the Day of Lavos. Chrono and his friends would not live to see the apocalypse, and neither would their great great grandchildren. yet the party decides to go on an adventure through time to save a future that is too distant to directly affect them. this underlines the selfless, altruistic nature of the quest.

ThatGuy

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #8 on: December 11, 2017, 12:55:23 pm »
Kind of off topic, but true...

Boo the Gentleman Caller

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2017, 01:39:23 pm »
I always took the earthquake line as a foreshadowing to Lavos, seeing that Lavos is deep under the earth and the ground shakes when it awakens (as seen in 13000BC and 1999AD).

Just my .02 cents.

Razig

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2017, 06:00:26 pm »
This is my take on it as well. A single millennium is nothing for a creature that lives untold millions of years. I think the earthquakes in 1000 AD are the early stirrings of Lavos beginning to awaken. Kind of like when you wake up a few minutes before your alarm clock goes off, and you know you may as well get out of bed, but instead you roll over and try to catch a few more Zs.  :P

Acacia Sgt

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2017, 10:14:03 pm »
Maybe it was a routine check. I would think Lavos would do that sort of think until it determined the time was right to decimate the planet and lay its spawn.

ThatGuy

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2017, 12:16:05 am »
So all the ice ages and other extinction level events were actually Lavos waking up so he can be like "ahhhh, yep... still got it." ?

Redline57

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2017, 01:04:50 am »
so can 65 million BC be considered an apocalypse? And I wonder, though Lavos shows spawn in 2300AD, what if this happened in the past? What if there were more than one Lavos (or at least spawning a new shell?) For canon's sake we estimate the timecrash was what, 2400AD in Chrono Cross? I guess that'd make the end of time sometime after that.

ThatGuy

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Re: Just Realized Something- multiple Lavos Apocalypses
« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2017, 03:10:06 am »
Well if 65milBC was an extinction level event (apocalypse-ish thing), it wasn't in the same way. As in, he didn't wake up, rain fire down upon the earth, etc.

There's pretty good reason to think that Lavos wasn't the first of his kind, considering he made spawn, and had to come from somewhere.

I like to think that Lavos-es travel through space and time, meaning, they might have to be spawned in 2300 AD, grow up, then go to a new planet and time travel back (or forward?) a few million years to show up at a good, early stage of the planet's life development.

And if you think about it, it kiiiinda makes sense seeing as how all these time gates seem pretty linked to Lavos. In fact... I'm about to start a new thread with a new thought...