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136
Characters, Plot, and Themes / Re: Lucca & Luccia? Ayla and Leah? Frog and Glenn (CC)?
« on: October 15, 2008, 07:52:45 pm »For those new to the Compendium there is an ongoing Chrono Cross hack that is adding plenty to Chrono Cross, included in those was implementing all of the characters from Chrono Trigger. Just an FYI.
Is this in reference to the hack that replaced Guile with Magus? I took a look at that and was pretty damn delighted, and I'm sure tossing Lucca in wouldn't be out of their league.
me and boo are both part of that project
rest assured you will be seeing lucca but not very soon we still have a long way to go yet !
So that means you're all hoping to actually rewrite Chrono Cross? Sure I had hoped for a little more explanation on things in CC, but wouldn't it make more sense for the actual game company that produced CC to remake and improve on the game's storyline? I know that it's a fan made hack, but CT: Crimson Echoes is different than this. It's a fan made sequel to the game, whereas you're trying to reshape CC in your own image by actually seeing Lucca(as flesh and blood, not as a ghost child) and Magus? There was a reason that SquareSoft decided not to include(in person) those two characters. If they should see fit that they make return appearances in CC, they would do so.
...but I guess that wouldn't stop ya. Since you guys are apparently already at it, might as well have a sidequest where you can actually visit Porre, learn more about Luccia, Norris and Grobyc. And might as well have Miguel as he is weakened during the fight to say a speech like 'I had never wanted to use my magic again, but this time I have no choice...' and then he uses Chrono Trigger's version of Luminaire. The more awesome version IMO.
137
History, Locations, and Artifacts / Re: Tower of Geddon - COMPANY 2400 - Arris Dome
« on: October 15, 2008, 04:03:34 am »
I had never thought that FATE was the one who destroyed the Dead Sea. I had always thought that Miguel, being alive in that dimensional distortion, held it together simply by being alive since he was the Guardian of the Dead Sea appointed by FATE.
(after several minutes of watching a Chrono Cross youtube.com video clip...)
Now I see why I always thought that the Dead Sea would cease to exist if Miguel died, it happens to say so, directly quoted from the game;
"Miguel:Wouldn't you all like to become one with this world?
-To be part of Eternity? How about it, Serge?
-You need no longer to struggle alone, nor fear an uncertain tomorrow.
-Well? What do you say?
(At this point you have the option of choosing 'Refuse!!!' or 'Accept...', which if I remember if you pick accept, your party members try to talk you out of it.)
Miguel:I see... I guess there's only one thing left to do then...
-I take it you're trying to restore the dimensional distortion?
-If you defeat me and liberate this place, the distortion will return to the way it was.
-I guess this is it... Just as there are times of peace, there are times of war...
-You don't have to hold back. Attack me with all your soul if you wish to live.
-Let fate take its course...!!!"
...After the battle everything starts to shake, it does confirm that FATE does indeed want and will destroy the Dead Sea with Serge and Co. in it. But the thing that's said immediately after everything starts to shake;
"Miguel:It looks like Fate has made its decision and has started to carry it now..."
Notice that he said 'Fate', not 'FATE', in that sentence. The whole Dead Sea disappearing just seems to me that it's a natural result of Miguel dying, he is the guardian of that place, not FATE(because FATE is in Another World), meaning that while Miguel is alive, he is keeping the Dead Sea existant. The Dead Sea is the keeper of the Frozen Flame in Home World, in this case FATE doesn't have access to, which Miguel explains why FATE will destroy the Dead Sea.
Anyhow, I believe two things were occurring during the cutscene, one of them, are those 3 flaming lines directed at the Tower of Geddon, which has been discussed as that being the action of FATE. And the other, that white light shooting at the sky. I don't know about you, but that doesn't seem like FATE's doing, more like the natural course of the Dead Sea about to be corrected(disappear to the Darkness Beyond Time) because there is no guardian to keep it existing.
This is how I see it. Miguel does mention that FATE predetermined everything that Serge and Co. would do and eventually arrive and meet up with Miguel at the Tower of Geddon. Lynx would have Serge's body and able FATE to access the Frozen Flame. FATE chose Miguel(because of his prowess, since to first timers he seems to kick your butt over and over) to become the guardian of the Dead Sea as FATE was not able to guard it itself, not being present in Home World. FATE wants Serge to die in the Dead Sea, so why wait until after Serge defeats Miguel? I believe FATE predetermined that Miguel would defeat Serge, should the two of them meet and do battle, FATE would have not worry about the Home World Frozen Flame to be accessed by another party than its own. Miguel seemed to have also thought that Serge would not be able to best him in combat and seemed to already accept the situation as it was. But when Serge defeats Miguel, his sight on things seemed to have shifted for the better of things, because let's face it, after the Dead Sea scenario, Serge and Co. just seems to straight out defy fate and destiny throughout the rest of the game, even the Sky Dragon seemed to be surprised by the turn of events and FATE just seemed to be in a state of panic towards Serge from the entire time that you actually see FATE in the game.
I also do believe that light that comes from the Tower of Geddon, was supposed to be the Home World's Frozen Flame about to reveal itself to Serge after Miguel was defeated. But of course it seems to be destoryed by FATE after the 3 flaming lines collide with the light as it results in that explosion that just plains wrecks all of the buildings and frozen water in the Dead Sea. Afterwards, there is an implosion, the energy of the explosion and the clouds in the sky gets sucked into a condensed white ball and thrown into the Darkness Beyond Time as Miguel said so himself.
After that explanation, I believe that FATE destroyed the Dead Sea, but did not make it disappear to the DBT, that effect was more from the defeat of Miguel. Kinda makes FATE's move on destroying the Dead Sea a little irrelevant since it was about to disappear anyway, perhaps that was just a method of hasting that effect and hopefully, in FATE's favor, would force Serge out of the scene for good.
Oh geez, I've been working on this for 3 hours and it's now 4AM. I apologize if any of my explanations hardly made any sense, I'm tired, let alone talking about time travel and dimensions is enough to make anyone easily falter in their theories.
(after several minutes of watching a Chrono Cross youtube.com video clip...)
Now I see why I always thought that the Dead Sea would cease to exist if Miguel died, it happens to say so, directly quoted from the game;
"Miguel:Wouldn't you all like to become one with this world?
-To be part of Eternity? How about it, Serge?
-You need no longer to struggle alone, nor fear an uncertain tomorrow.
-Well? What do you say?
(At this point you have the option of choosing 'Refuse!!!' or 'Accept...', which if I remember if you pick accept, your party members try to talk you out of it.)
Miguel:I see... I guess there's only one thing left to do then...
-I take it you're trying to restore the dimensional distortion?
-If you defeat me and liberate this place, the distortion will return to the way it was.
-I guess this is it... Just as there are times of peace, there are times of war...
-You don't have to hold back. Attack me with all your soul if you wish to live.
-Let fate take its course...!!!"
...After the battle everything starts to shake, it does confirm that FATE does indeed want and will destroy the Dead Sea with Serge and Co. in it. But the thing that's said immediately after everything starts to shake;
"Miguel:It looks like Fate has made its decision and has started to carry it now..."
Notice that he said 'Fate', not 'FATE', in that sentence. The whole Dead Sea disappearing just seems to me that it's a natural result of Miguel dying, he is the guardian of that place, not FATE(because FATE is in Another World), meaning that while Miguel is alive, he is keeping the Dead Sea existant. The Dead Sea is the keeper of the Frozen Flame in Home World, in this case FATE doesn't have access to, which Miguel explains why FATE will destroy the Dead Sea.
Anyhow, I believe two things were occurring during the cutscene, one of them, are those 3 flaming lines directed at the Tower of Geddon, which has been discussed as that being the action of FATE. And the other, that white light shooting at the sky. I don't know about you, but that doesn't seem like FATE's doing, more like the natural course of the Dead Sea about to be corrected(disappear to the Darkness Beyond Time) because there is no guardian to keep it existing.
This is how I see it. Miguel does mention that FATE predetermined everything that Serge and Co. would do and eventually arrive and meet up with Miguel at the Tower of Geddon. Lynx would have Serge's body and able FATE to access the Frozen Flame. FATE chose Miguel(because of his prowess, since to first timers he seems to kick your butt over and over) to become the guardian of the Dead Sea as FATE was not able to guard it itself, not being present in Home World. FATE wants Serge to die in the Dead Sea, so why wait until after Serge defeats Miguel? I believe FATE predetermined that Miguel would defeat Serge, should the two of them meet and do battle, FATE would have not worry about the Home World Frozen Flame to be accessed by another party than its own. Miguel seemed to have also thought that Serge would not be able to best him in combat and seemed to already accept the situation as it was. But when Serge defeats Miguel, his sight on things seemed to have shifted for the better of things, because let's face it, after the Dead Sea scenario, Serge and Co. just seems to straight out defy fate and destiny throughout the rest of the game, even the Sky Dragon seemed to be surprised by the turn of events and FATE just seemed to be in a state of panic towards Serge from the entire time that you actually see FATE in the game.
I also do believe that light that comes from the Tower of Geddon, was supposed to be the Home World's Frozen Flame about to reveal itself to Serge after Miguel was defeated. But of course it seems to be destoryed by FATE after the 3 flaming lines collide with the light as it results in that explosion that just plains wrecks all of the buildings and frozen water in the Dead Sea. Afterwards, there is an implosion, the energy of the explosion and the clouds in the sky gets sucked into a condensed white ball and thrown into the Darkness Beyond Time as Miguel said so himself.
After that explanation, I believe that FATE destroyed the Dead Sea, but did not make it disappear to the DBT, that effect was more from the defeat of Miguel. Kinda makes FATE's move on destroying the Dead Sea a little irrelevant since it was about to disappear anyway, perhaps that was just a method of hasting that effect and hopefully, in FATE's favor, would force Serge out of the scene for good.
Oh geez, I've been working on this for 3 hours and it's now 4AM. I apologize if any of my explanations hardly made any sense, I'm tired, let alone talking about time travel and dimensions is enough to make anyone easily falter in their theories.
138
Chrono / Gameplay Casual Discussion / Re: After separating Schala from Lavos...
« on: October 15, 2008, 12:49:23 am »
lol I know Porre isn't Tokyo, what I was trying to say is that I imagined Porre possibly resembling Tokyo in 1020AD, since they were quoted in the game as technologically advanced than the rest of the world. And well Japan is a country that thrives on creating better technology.
139
Chrono / Gameplay Casual Discussion / Re: The Chrono Series and School.
« on: October 09, 2008, 11:41:34 pm »
Not anymore, I'm no longer in school. lol But at one time in English class I wrote a short story concerning a mentally retarded guy time-travelling. 
140
Chrono / Gameplay Casual Discussion / Re: After separating Schala from Lavos...
« on: October 09, 2008, 11:34:46 pm »
I always thought that the person in the city, whether it be Schala or Kid or both as merged, I thought that she was in Porre in the merged dimension of Home and Another. After all Porre became technologically advanced from help outside of time, correct?
141
Characters, Plot, and Themes / Re: Chrono's Mom
« on: October 09, 2008, 12:28:03 pm »
I've always wondered if Crono's mom produced Crono like Mary produced Jesus? 
142
Characters, Plot, and Themes / Re: Kid and Harle
« on: October 09, 2008, 12:26:58 pm »
Pretty sure I heard somewhere that Harle was created by the Dragons and they had somehow taken DNA from Schala to make her. They wanted an agent of their own, but perhaps only had enough to power during the temporal storm to grant their agent some magical ability, but not a physical form. Therefore they had somehow obtained DNA from Schala to grant Harle life. PRETTY SURE I heard that somewhere... lol I can't remember if it was in the game or at a fan website.
143
Chrono / Gameplay Casual Discussion / Re: After separating Schala from Lavos...
« on: October 08, 2008, 09:04:34 pm »
After everything that's mentioned in the game, it always seems to be hinting that Schala and Kid merge, with Schala being the dominant personnality. Right before you enter the Darkness of Time with the Chrono Cross and seeing those 3 ghosts of Crono, Marle and Lucca;
Kid:
You're wrong! I'm me!
I ain't no Schala's
daughter or clone!
Lucca:
......
Yes, that's right Kid!
If that's how you feel...
I think Princess Schala
would have wanted it to
be that way too!
Kid:
......
Right there is basically Lucca trying to comfort Kid from the truth that she is only a lesser version of Schala.
And then right before the credits in Schala's diary;
'But I'm sure we'll meet again.
Someday, you and I...
Another place, another time.
It's just that we might not realize
That you are you and I am me...'
Also the fact on why Schala created Kid. Schala heard Serge's cry for help from across time while he was drowning and before her anger and sadness took over, she had created Kid and sent her to the future just in time to rescue Serge. Now at the time of Schala's release from Lavos and she gives her very long dialogue, it already seems apparent to me that they have already merged, even if the last message was spoken like Kid would've said it in her Australian accent. That part might've been Schala saying it like Kid would've just to make Serge feel better and to remind him that he won't actually be losing Kid that he knows and loves... In a sense.
Don't get me wrong, I don't want the aftermath of the events for Schala and Kid being the same person(it would mess up my 2 and a half years of work for my Chrono #3 fanfiction plot). It just seems to me that Chrono Cross struck me as a very vague and cruel story where you wouldn't take everything being said in the game as seriously and not everything would be OK after the final battle like what happened to Chrono Trigger. The game struck me mainly as the consequence of time-travel. After the final battle you see everyone saying goodbye to Serge and saying that they'll meet again, but with their memories of their adventure going to be purged, it is indeed cruel for the characters. I'm sure a few of you would agree.
And ONSLAUGHT, I did consider it's possible that Schala decided not to merge and allowed Kid to be her own person, even if she was simply an extension of Schala in order to save Serge. The whole purpose of the game was to release Schala from her sadness and anger, thus Schala would once again be the gentle and compassionate character from Chrono Trigger. But I would think that would create another problem for the Chrono Universe. It may just be me being messed up, but most likely just the game being messed up, I just feel that Schala's only way out of the Darkness of Time was to merge with Kid. It's not so far-fetched of an idea.
Kid:
You're wrong! I'm me!
I ain't no Schala's
daughter or clone!
Lucca:
......
Yes, that's right Kid!
If that's how you feel...
I think Princess Schala
would have wanted it to
be that way too!
Kid:
......
Right there is basically Lucca trying to comfort Kid from the truth that she is only a lesser version of Schala.
And then right before the credits in Schala's diary;
'But I'm sure we'll meet again.
Someday, you and I...
Another place, another time.
It's just that we might not realize
That you are you and I am me...'
Also the fact on why Schala created Kid. Schala heard Serge's cry for help from across time while he was drowning and before her anger and sadness took over, she had created Kid and sent her to the future just in time to rescue Serge. Now at the time of Schala's release from Lavos and she gives her very long dialogue, it already seems apparent to me that they have already merged, even if the last message was spoken like Kid would've said it in her Australian accent. That part might've been Schala saying it like Kid would've just to make Serge feel better and to remind him that he won't actually be losing Kid that he knows and loves... In a sense.
Don't get me wrong, I don't want the aftermath of the events for Schala and Kid being the same person(it would mess up my 2 and a half years of work for my Chrono #3 fanfiction plot). It just seems to me that Chrono Cross struck me as a very vague and cruel story where you wouldn't take everything being said in the game as seriously and not everything would be OK after the final battle like what happened to Chrono Trigger. The game struck me mainly as the consequence of time-travel. After the final battle you see everyone saying goodbye to Serge and saying that they'll meet again, but with their memories of their adventure going to be purged, it is indeed cruel for the characters. I'm sure a few of you would agree.
And ONSLAUGHT, I did consider it's possible that Schala decided not to merge and allowed Kid to be her own person, even if she was simply an extension of Schala in order to save Serge. The whole purpose of the game was to release Schala from her sadness and anger, thus Schala would once again be the gentle and compassionate character from Chrono Trigger. But I would think that would create another problem for the Chrono Universe. It may just be me being messed up, but most likely just the game being messed up, I just feel that Schala's only way out of the Darkness of Time was to merge with Kid. It's not so far-fetched of an idea.
144
Chrono / Gameplay Casual Discussion / Re: After separating Schala from Lavos...
« on: October 08, 2008, 06:42:50 pm »
I can't believe I didn't think of this before. I went on YouTube to review the game's ending. I think that even though Serge may have been saying stuff to Leena, seems to me that he had already forgotten about Kid and his companions. Perhaps the memory eraser was a gradual effect and not all at once.
A direct quote from Schala at the near end of her long dialogue;
'Time, which has been divided,
will be unified again now.
The time for farewells has come...
You will lose all memory of
this whole adventure
and return to your own time.
But this time, you will be able
to live your own life!'
This suggests that yes he will lose all of his memories, whether that be immediately or gradual. SquareSoft(at the time) seemed to like being very vague in this game.
A direct quote from Schala at the near end of her long dialogue;
'Time, which has been divided,
will be unified again now.
The time for farewells has come...
You will lose all memory of
this whole adventure
and return to your own time.
But this time, you will be able
to live your own life!'
This suggests that yes he will lose all of his memories, whether that be immediately or gradual. SquareSoft(at the time) seemed to like being very vague in this game.
145
Chrono / Gameplay Casual Discussion / Re: chrono trigger museum? what?
« on: October 08, 2008, 05:07:31 pm »Epoch and jet bike rides needed.
Hell, a Chrono theme park would be awesome!
...a hike on the treacherous mountain, Death Peak! Just be sure to not get eaten by Lavos Spawns!
146
Chrono / Gameplay Casual Discussion / After separating Schala from Lavos...
« on: October 08, 2008, 04:58:28 pm »
...what exactly happened? There are 2 questions that I have been pondering over that would make my work slightly easier; Did Schala and Kid become one person or did Schala allowed Kid to be her own personnality? And did Serge and company had their memory erased/lost of the events that took place throughout the game?
I kept purposely not using the Chrono Cross until after I've seen all the possible endings first, then finally used it. So I have only seen the good ending once and that's been more than 2 years ago.
So far this website has been the most helpful in answering many questions, but I'd like to know some insight from some forum posters if they know the answer to these two questions. Thanks!
I kept purposely not using the Chrono Cross until after I've seen all the possible endings first, then finally used it. So I have only seen the good ending once and that's been more than 2 years ago.
So far this website has been the most helpful in answering many questions, but I'd like to know some insight from some forum posters if they know the answer to these two questions. Thanks!
147
Lavos, the Planet, and other Entities / Re: So, What is the Entity in CT?
« on: October 08, 2008, 04:24:57 pm »
Wouldn't Balthasar be the one benefitting most from the events of Chrono Cross? Did he not say that he basically orchestrated everything up until the moment that Serge and company defeated the Dragon God? He seemed to me that he was the only one that truly wanted Schala to be free from Lavos. He was the only one who somehow knew of what was going on even from the moment Schala went MIA from Chrono Trigger. After the whole speech about the Time Devourer and the Chrono Cross, he suddenly disappears...
Now to get back on topic, I think that the planet is the entity, Chrono Cross convinced me and also other arguments from previous topics I've seen.. I hope to God that the planet is the entity, it would require me changing a few things here and there on my Chrono #3 fanfic(doubt that Square-Enix would take it for a script) that I've been working on for 2 years and 2 months(as of yesterday).
Now to get back on topic, I think that the planet is the entity, Chrono Cross convinced me and also other arguments from previous topics I've seen.. I hope to God that the planet is the entity, it would require me changing a few things here and there on my Chrono #3 fanfic(doubt that Square-Enix would take it for a script) that I've been working on for 2 years and 2 months(as of yesterday).