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Site Updates / Re: "Crimson Echoes: The Month that Could Have Been" starts NOW!
« on: May 30, 2009, 06:01:28 pm »
There is a topic on something awful about this. They think the leak is the 98% version.
Anybody with an account or $10 wanna talk to them about it? (I don't have one)
http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3145716
The conversation turned to how much they hate the retranslation quickly
Anybody with an account or $10 wanna talk to them about it? (I don't have one)
http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3145716
The conversation turned to how much they hate the retranslation quickly
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Site Updates / Re: "Crimson Echoes: The Month that Could Have Been" starts NOW!
« on: May 30, 2009, 03:12:19 pm »
How come nobody seems worried Square Enix will sue for the leak. Even though it is only 80-90% or whatever instead of 98% done it still violates their copywrite and the C&D to destroy all data right? I don't think they will sue but I thought others were worried about this and how an anonymous leak would be horrible and destroy their lives.
awesome videos I'll watch them every day
awesome videos I'll watch them every day
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Site Updates / Re: The Month That Could Have Been Announcement
« on: May 28, 2009, 02:58:01 pm »
They could use the annotations on youtube to link to different videos every time there is a choice
Also how come I don't see this on any other sites yet? This is why waiting for an official response was dumb nobody else cares much anymore. Priority number one should be to get a penny arcade comic about this that is how the porn site beat Nintendo after all. (OK maybe not but a comic would be awesome. A game journalist asking somebody at E3 during an interview maybe a developer about this or fangames would also be awesome)
Also I think the debate about releasing the game or not is interesting. (I still think Square got tricked by Dark Sage and that matters a lot because they would probably sue a profiting game but never waste time on a free fangame even if they mistakenly sent a C&D to them and are to stubborn/lazy/don't want any more attention from the press to undo the thing.)
Anyways I just wanna add that even though SE are rich doesn't mean they will waste time money and a huge explosion of negative news and hate from their fans on a case they probably won't win (i'm sure they aren't responsible for an unprovable anonymous beta leak)over a thing that barely affects them like a romhack just to spite and destroy a person's life at great cost to them. that is not how corporations work.
Also I'm wondering why nobody has mentioned the possibility of a low settlement if they do actually sue so that nobody has to destroy their life/schedule going to court? isn't that how most lawsuits end up? Don't people actually pirating things only get $3000 that'd be easily get able in a pay for legal fees donation drive especially with the suit getting mentioned on every gaming site ever and it could be even less like 200.
Still looking forward to the videos I'm sure whatever the CE team decides is best and I support whatever they do cause it is their decision
Also how come I don't see this on any other sites yet? This is why waiting for an official response was dumb nobody else cares much anymore. Priority number one should be to get a penny arcade comic about this that is how the porn site beat Nintendo after all. (OK maybe not but a comic would be awesome. A game journalist asking somebody at E3 during an interview maybe a developer about this or fangames would also be awesome)
Also I think the debate about releasing the game or not is interesting. (I still think Square got tricked by Dark Sage and that matters a lot because they would probably sue a profiting game but never waste time on a free fangame even if they mistakenly sent a C&D to them and are to stubborn/lazy/don't want any more attention from the press to undo the thing.)
Anyways I just wanna add that even though SE are rich doesn't mean they will waste time money and a huge explosion of negative news and hate from their fans on a case they probably won't win (i'm sure they aren't responsible for an unprovable anonymous beta leak)over a thing that barely affects them like a romhack just to spite and destroy a person's life at great cost to them. that is not how corporations work.
Also I'm wondering why nobody has mentioned the possibility of a low settlement if they do actually sue so that nobody has to destroy their life/schedule going to court? isn't that how most lawsuits end up? Don't people actually pirating things only get $3000 that'd be easily get able in a pay for legal fees donation drive especially with the suit getting mentioned on every gaming site ever and it could be even less like 200.
Still looking forward to the videos I'm sure whatever the CE team decides is best and I support whatever they do cause it is their decision
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Site Updates / Re: The Month That Could Have Been Announcement
« on: May 28, 2009, 03:03:15 am »
I'm looking forward to the videos I'm sure they will be awesome thanks.
some questions
Aren't you worried about more legal threats/copy write claims on youtube?( though I personally think square would never sue over videos they might bluff a threat) I think a trailer and a whole month for this is the worst idea ever and everything should be uploaded to many places at once when they are all done.
Did you guys ever contact any of the lawyers or groups posted about in the threads? It'd be interesting what they would have had to say about this for future projects other people might get attacked for.
I don't get why people are so sure an anonymous leaked beta from a tester would result in the team getting hit. Wouldn't "we did everything we could to comply with SE and delete it but one of the testers leaked it against our best efforts and orders we aren't responsible" be a good defence how could the judge hold them responsible for anything what did they do and why would SE even try wasn't their case already iffy? Did anybody ask a lawyer about this?
Also when I was looking up the laws I'm pretty sure jail time is impossible because criminal charges only apply to profiting pirates but I could be wrong.
But obviously none of that matters now I'm happy with whatever the CE team does
some questions
Aren't you worried about more legal threats/copy write claims on youtube?( though I personally think square would never sue over videos they might bluff a threat) I think a trailer and a whole month for this is the worst idea ever and everything should be uploaded to many places at once when they are all done.
Did you guys ever contact any of the lawyers or groups posted about in the threads? It'd be interesting what they would have had to say about this for future projects other people might get attacked for.
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that would only causepeople to get sued, guaranteed fines, possibly jail time.
I don't get why people are so sure an anonymous leaked beta from a tester would result in the team getting hit. Wouldn't "we did everything we could to comply with SE and delete it but one of the testers leaked it against our best efforts and orders we aren't responsible" be a good defence how could the judge hold them responsible for anything what did they do and why would SE even try wasn't their case already iffy? Did anybody ask a lawyer about this?
Also when I was looking up the laws I'm pretty sure jail time is impossible because criminal charges only apply to profiting pirates but I could be wrong.
But obviously none of that matters now I'm happy with whatever the CE team does
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Site Updates / Re: Cease & Desist Letter
« on: May 26, 2009, 09:13:01 pm »
ya I'd like to see how other companies would respond to the same letter could you do that Dark Serge?
lol at them copy writing screenshots. they have a lot of work to do if they wanna get all of those off the internet.
lol at them copy writing screenshots. they have a lot of work to do if they wanna get all of those off the internet.
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Site Updates / Re: Cease & Desist Letter
« on: May 26, 2009, 07:52:18 pm »Quote
I expect the video game industry, and SE in particular, to "get it" much sooner than, say, the music industry--which has been eviscerated by its own trade group--but for that to happen there will have to be compelling fan works out there, accessible to the world, and thus able to demonstrate their value
Doesn't the video game industry as a whole already "get it" though or else the thousands of fanfiction, music remixes, flash videos and every other hack or fan game besides this one wouldn't exist without getting sued over. How else would card sagas wars be able to get away with what they are planning so far despite their youtube trailer getting over 175 000 views. Nintendo has to know about the billion mario hacks out there but nothing is done.
I still think the only reason this one got hit was because SE did not do their research and mistook it for something everybody would agree they should have a problem with and that if CE were released right now they would not be sued. But I understand it is easy to say that and hard to do so I don't blame anyone for not doing that.
I don't think a fan work being of compelling value would help the legal situation change at all. How good would a game have to be in order to advance the struggle for intellectual property law more than anything released so far?
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Site Updates / Re: Cease & Desist Letter
« on: May 21, 2009, 06:03:38 pm »
I've thought of something that might be neat to try if the secret talks never get anywhere. I can't think of anything wrong with it so I'll post it here and everyone can tell me what they think if there is anything I'm missing or it is the worst idea ever or whatever. Sorry is is long
Basically you said you'd like a 2nd message from square so take the talks public and somebody in the project would write a public email to Square asking them to respond. It would say something like this:
1)First talk about how we suspect the C&D was based on lies and misinformation of a troll (talk about that email posted and why it looks legit with the forum posts on ign and gamespot. And the copy protection stuff suggesting square thought it was the ds version and saying you claim copywrite in the C&D)
2)Then simply ask that square publicly responds with a second C&D letter you'll publicly post confirming that they are aware of all the facts (you are hardcore fans who love them and advertise CT DS in the game and are not profiting and it is an ips patch of the snes version and there is no evidence or reason to believe they will lose profits if it is released. what temporal flux is, negative press showing support for you from gamers) and if they still want you to stop. If they knew all these facts before the first one a second one should be as simple and easy as pie!
3)optionally politely ask for an explanation why they are targeting this game but not any other romhackers on the web for any of their games that are doing the exact same thing as you. Also optionally ask to clarify why is temporal flux illegal when the snes game has no copy protection.
4) If they do not send you anything by some day, you can only logically assume that they have reconsidered after learning more info and that first C&D was based on lies and invalid. you can safely ignore it from then on and square is not aloud to sue you.(maybe ask a lawyer if that is true
) and you and all ct fans would be eternally grateful and love them for understanding their fans it was all that troll's fault and you will buy lots of their games. If they do send one you will be sad but continue to comply.
The plan would be if you don't get a response to finish up CE 100% and release it as quickly as possible without fear of being sued. If they do then youtube is probably the only thing left.
The possible results of this I see are:
1)Square will not sue you immediately for asking for a second C&D to confirm. It is probably not illigal anyways and it will cost them money and publicity and make them look like big jerks when they could just send a free email.
2)It would be illogical to not say anything then sue after you release it. It would cost them money they won't get back make them look like big jerks and make tonnes of publicity for a game that is now on the internet causing many to play it. Sending a 2nd email before it is released would be better
3) They could respond and stick to their guns. You are no worse off then before but now have that second public response you said you wanted for more negative press now complete with an interesting story of an internet troll bringing down a community with lies and square being gullible and stubborn. It is an interesting story that will spread everywhere I see a movie based on this.
4) Square sends an apology and free games. hurrah you win there is a huge victory party on the internets lol
I hope the plan is clear and I don't see any downsides to doing this. Of course it is up to the CE team and they can do whatever they think is best I'm probably missing some big reason why this would result in disaster. i'm not a lawyer and I don't know what they've said behind the scenes so those people would know better then me.
Keep up the excellent work
Basically you said you'd like a 2nd message from square so take the talks public and somebody in the project would write a public email to Square asking them to respond. It would say something like this:
1)First talk about how we suspect the C&D was based on lies and misinformation of a troll (talk about that email posted and why it looks legit with the forum posts on ign and gamespot. And the copy protection stuff suggesting square thought it was the ds version and saying you claim copywrite in the C&D)
2)Then simply ask that square publicly responds with a second C&D letter you'll publicly post confirming that they are aware of all the facts (you are hardcore fans who love them and advertise CT DS in the game and are not profiting and it is an ips patch of the snes version and there is no evidence or reason to believe they will lose profits if it is released. what temporal flux is, negative press showing support for you from gamers) and if they still want you to stop. If they knew all these facts before the first one a second one should be as simple and easy as pie!
3)optionally politely ask for an explanation why they are targeting this game but not any other romhackers on the web for any of their games that are doing the exact same thing as you. Also optionally ask to clarify why is temporal flux illegal when the snes game has no copy protection.
4) If they do not send you anything by some day, you can only logically assume that they have reconsidered after learning more info and that first C&D was based on lies and invalid. you can safely ignore it from then on and square is not aloud to sue you.(maybe ask a lawyer if that is true
) and you and all ct fans would be eternally grateful and love them for understanding their fans it was all that troll's fault and you will buy lots of their games. If they do send one you will be sad but continue to comply. The plan would be if you don't get a response to finish up CE 100% and release it as quickly as possible without fear of being sued. If they do then youtube is probably the only thing left.
The possible results of this I see are:
1)Square will not sue you immediately for asking for a second C&D to confirm. It is probably not illigal anyways and it will cost them money and publicity and make them look like big jerks when they could just send a free email.
2)It would be illogical to not say anything then sue after you release it. It would cost them money they won't get back make them look like big jerks and make tonnes of publicity for a game that is now on the internet causing many to play it. Sending a 2nd email before it is released would be better
3) They could respond and stick to their guns. You are no worse off then before but now have that second public response you said you wanted for more negative press now complete with an interesting story of an internet troll bringing down a community with lies and square being gullible and stubborn. It is an interesting story that will spread everywhere I see a movie based on this.
4) Square sends an apology and free games. hurrah you win there is a huge victory party on the internets
lolI hope the plan is clear and I don't see any downsides to doing this. Of course it is up to the CE team and they can do whatever they think is best I'm probably missing some big reason why this would result in disaster. i'm not a lawyer and I don't know what they've said behind the scenes so those people would know better then me.
Keep up the excellent work
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Site Updates / Re: Straight Talk Express with the Compendium...Next Stop: Truth
« on: May 21, 2009, 01:58:51 pm »
Once it is released there is nothing square or the courts can do to delete or forbid it from the Internet. Prophet's guile is still hosted on romhacking.net and zophar and a bunch of other sites. I wonder why Square isn't C&Ding them for that and all the other romhacks on their sites. Doesn't seem fair
The romhacking.net legal opinion was posted so I guess I'll show zophar.net's they seem much more sure about it.
The romhacking.net legal opinion was posted so I guess I'll show zophar.net's they seem much more sure about it.
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There is no illegal content hosted on Zophar's Domain. Files such as emulators, hacks, utilities and other programs that can be used to modify or use copyrighted content themselves are not illegal, and although it is a wet dream for the departments of some companies, they never will be illegal.
The emulation scene and this site has been alive for over a decade, and we will forever be here.
If you wish to contact us due to any concerns, please use the contact form or post in the forums.
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Site Updates / Re: Straight Talk Express with the Compendium...Next Stop: Truth
« on: May 21, 2009, 02:36:19 am »
wikipedia says Statutory damages are calculated per work infringed
here is the law on damages they used as a source if anybody wants to try and understand it.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/504.html#c
Think positive! if the judge likes you it could be the minimum $200
Also don't forget Square would get a loooooot more negative news about them if they did sue anybody that I'm sure they'd like to avoid.
here is the law on damages they used as a source if anybody wants to try and understand it.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/504.html#c
Think positive! if the judge likes you it could be the minimum $200
Also don't forget Square would get a loooooot more negative news about them if they did sue anybody that I'm sure they'd like to avoid.
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Site Updates / Re: C&D: Director's Response
« on: May 20, 2009, 07:31:55 pm »Quote
They where misinformed. Of course now that the big wheels of bussiness have turned it may be impossible to save CE....BUT WE MUST NOT GIVE UP!
I can think of one similar gaming example where the wheels of business were reversed
http://www.gamespot.com/news/6112603.html It's number 4 on the page. Nintendo apologized for mistakingly C&Ding a porn site for mentioning zelda. Maybe a bit of hope. Although this is different square could be sending you free games in the end!
Also you should definitely let Lowtax from something awful do the the negotiations with Square he has a good record:P http://www.somethingawful.com/d/legal-threats/ Maybe he'll be good inspiration reading that stuff is more fun the hungry hungry hippos.
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Site Updates / Re: Straight Talk Express with the Compendium...Next Stop: Truth
« on: May 19, 2009, 12:34:59 am »
Hi. I'm really disappointed square did this the game would have been fun to play and I hope it gets released sometime.
I hope you don't mind if I ask you guys some questions.
Why do they have have to say anything? They already got everything they asked for in the C&D. Why would they do anything that would just create more negative press. Especially after you guys said you are not going to do anything until you get a response and then are going to use it for more press. The posts on other sites about this seem to be decreasing and I doubt any game journalists are asking them about it or will ask them in an interview unless people bug them to do that. (It would be cool if they did ask square about it)
Are the secret behind the scenes talks people have been hinting at actual talking to eachother talks or is it we are waiting for a response to our first email talks? I hope it is the first one.
What made people so sure that the guy who posted that stuff you deleted could be fired if square saw it? I doubt he would be dumb enough to post something that would get him fired but I could be wrong.
Good luck with everything!
I hope you don't mind if I ask you guys some questions.
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Not all hope is lost until there's an official response that we can use to judge SE's attitude post-fallout. They've gotta say something eventually.
Why do they have have to say anything? They already got everything they asked for in the C&D. Why would they do anything that would just create more negative press. Especially after you guys said you are not going to do anything until you get a response and then are going to use it for more press. The posts on other sites about this seem to be decreasing and I doubt any game journalists are asking them about it or will ask them in an interview unless people bug them to do that. (It would be cool if they did ask square about it)
Are the secret behind the scenes talks people have been hinting at actual talking to eachother talks or is it we are waiting for a response to our first email talks? I hope it is the first one.
What made people so sure that the guy who posted that stuff you deleted could be fired if square saw it? I doubt he would be dumb enough to post something that would get him fired but I could be wrong.
Good luck with everything!
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