Author Topic: The Thread for Writers  (Read 34655 times)

Uboa

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #15 on: March 28, 2009, 01:43:43 am »
On an unrelated note: Unless there's porn on the cover of a book, one of the great things about books is that there's no such thing as “NSFW.” I think literature would be more interesting if people would not get so hung-up on sex. Almost everyone has a sex drive; there's no point in pretending otherwise. A good writer strives to understand the human condition...not ignore it. We should all be forced in school to write an extremely sexually explicit essay (fictional of course), and then we would all be able to get on with our lives.

I don't know that writing a sexually explicit essay is the best way to understand the human condition.  As someone who has read a lot of bad X-rated fanfiction I feel safe in guessing that those stories are probably as unenlightening to write as they are to read.

(Second sex-related post for me in a row tonight...  Something in the air?  Something in my tea?)

I originally grabbed this quote to respond to the part about NSFW books, or lack thereof.  This is something that I am very thankful for.  I've actually watched all kinds of NSFW movies at work, and have just hoped that my co-worker is looking the other way when there's an exposed breast on the screen, or something.  Books make these work situations much more comfortable!

Now I'm going to finish reading your post.

Edit:  Finished.  So, to address several things you brought up in no particular order...

So you actually managed to write a good game on a calculator?  That's really cool.  I really wish I had been in a position to learn how to write basic code in high school, or earlier.  The farthest I ever got on a TI calculator was a jack-ass program to put someone's name in an unflattering sentence.  Like you I'm probably going to end up buying a licensed copy of Game Maker to try to write the game I have in mind, and pretty soon.  I'm hoping to have the basic environment coded up within a year.  I guess I'm glad I put off learning how to really code until now so that I could get my personal crap straight and thereby learn what would actually make a good game, if that makes any sense.  It fits under the heading of trying to understand the human condition, from my point of view.

Dream Child is in the Submissions subforum right now (1.5 chapters).  After watching an RD playthrough I was really inspired to write a fanfiction about Magus, and I'd always been a Samus fan.  I guess I see the two of them as equals in a sense given both of their rocky childhoods and their being raised by non-humans.  I also see them as equals from an adventuring point of view, and I realized that I really wanted to go on an adventure with both of them.  So, that's what I've been doing.

FFVI has always seemed really daunting as a subject for fanfiction.  If you come up with something good around your idea I'd really like to see it.

I used to really want full legal control over my work, but when I settled down at my current job I realized that what mattered more to me was just being able to tell a story, maybe something along the lines of "my" story.  If it happened to play out in the Chrono or Metroid universe that would be fine with me.  I see video game universes and characters as a kind of mythology that I grew up with, and I know that they are a widely shared mythology today.  So, that's how I treat them.  I hope it works out.

To answer your question about Samus being a righty or a lefty:  I think that she's right handed, but she's learned to be partially ambidextrous over time as a result of using the power suit.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2009, 02:22:35 am by Uboa »

skylark

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #16 on: March 29, 2009, 12:33:02 am »
I couldn't disagree with you more. I said earlier that many people are poor writers and have no business writing. I meant that, but I didn't explain it clearly enough. Looking back at my topic post in this thread, I didn't properly explain the distinction between seeing stories and telling them. When a person writes, they can do so for either of two reasons, or both at once: They can write for themselves, or they can write for others. That's the difference between seeing a story and telling it.

Writing for oneself is something that I think everybody should do. And that's going to result in a lot of bad writing...but that doesn't matter, because when you write for yourself the meaningfulness is in the actual process of doing the writing, telling the story. If it's good afterwards, and worth rereading in future times, that's gravy. But that's not what it's about. Legacies be damned, appearances be damned, and other people—including our own future selves—can take their opinions and go to hell. Writing for oneself is an expression of passion and expression of intelligence and should never be stifled, as surely as humming. Maybe if we recorded all of the sounds that ever come out of our mouths, we'd look back on some of them and say “That was terrible!” But who gives a flying frak? We don't hum to gain approval from our peers or our future selves. We hum because it enriches us right here in the moment.

So I'm disappointed that you threw away your old material and think so poorly of yourself for having ever written it. Even though you will inevitably change over time, and thus change in your opinions, it is a loss to lose track of your earlier perspective.

I appreciate the sentiment, really.

But a bad fic is a bad fic, there's no two ways around it. I never even showed it to anyone, but I know it was terrible looking back. However, it's because it was so terrible that I was able to use it as a reference of how not to write.

I was pretty cocky about my writing skills back then, thinking it was the best thing ever. I see it as an ego-deflation, not as thinking poorly of myself. I can understand why you would have thought I was putting myself down, though. My bad. :)

Thought

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #17 on: April 01, 2009, 07:07:32 pm »
Someone like me can't help but do it this way, and I suspect you're similar, so if you're having Gary Stu problems then I'd think the solution would be more exposure to those kinds of characterizations, rather than less, so that you can mature and refine your authorial control.

At least insofar as my own writing is concerned (and I suspect in other people's writing as well), every character is a surrogate. From the smallest bit character to the villain to the hero, every character I write has a little piece of me in them. It seems rather reasonable; mine is the only mind and behavior I know well enough to write. Even when I try to write a character totally different than myself, I still am doing so through my own perceptions.

The Gary Stu/Mary Sue character is such a travesty to me because it is actually the exception. Gary Stus tend to be the idealization of the author, which is to say, there is nothing of the author in them. To use an analogy, it is sort of like the difference between a costume and a puppet. Other characters are costumes; the author puts them on, pretends to be the person, dances around, then changes into a different one. But the Gary Stu is too apart from the author, there just isn't room in the idealized form for the author to fit. No matter how skillful the puppet-mastery is, the strings give it clearly away that the puppet is just a puppet and not a person.

And this relates to something you said earlier...

We should all be forced in school to write an extremely sexually explicit essay (fictional of course), and then we would all be able to get on with our lives.

I once heard a suggestion along those lines before. It was from a professional writer, I think (but don't remember, so who knows). Specifically, it went somewhere along the lines of: "every writer should be forced to write one noble-suicide story. That way they could get it out of their system and move on."

But anywho, sex in writing is always so hard to pull off well because it tends to attempt to simulate an act between two (or more) people, but the writing of the scene is inherently masturbatory. As I said above, the author tends to be in every character. As such, in sex scenes, the author is really just having sex with himself. Masturbating and sex are very different activities and experiences; trying to pass the former off as the later is beyond most authors. Yet at the same time, sex is such a driving passion in humans that many can't help but try.

I've never figured out why the noble-suicide comes up so often, however.

Off-topic and perhaps unfair, so feel free to decline to answer. But: If I remember correctly, you're married, right? And you're roughly my age. (I'm 26.) So, out of your proposed “inner need for romance,” would you say you have that to your satisfaction now? Or does it still dominate your writing? (Presumably “both” is also an answer, under special conditions...)

Well I can't righty say, as I haven't been writing much lately. But if I had to answer, I'd answer "both." A real person will never give you exactly what you can imagine, and your imagination will never give you exactly what you really need. There is always space that one or the other can't fill.

That being said, "yes" could also be a valid answer. Having seen what real romance is like, I look back at what I thought it was and kind of laugh at how low I had set my sights.

And with that being said, "no" could also be a valid answer. Having seen how low I had set my sights in the past, I realize I can set them higher still.

I have almost all of my electronic work, all the way back to our first family computer in the 1990s when I wrote in WordPerfect on a blue screen with white text.

Ah, that brings back memories. There is still something inherently nice about a blue screen. I learned to write on that version of WordPerfect. One of the reasons I lost some of my stories was I never updated them, both from WordPerfect format and from floppy disk (it’s getting hard to find computers with floppy drives now days).

In fact, my typing skills came entirely as a side gift from my writing. In middle school, I had almost no skills whatsoever. I used my index fingers on the keyboard. I thought I would never be able to type like those people who could just stare at the screen and type like cheetahs and never even look down at their hands. But that's exactly what I became...because I wrote so much. My fingers fell into the patterns. To this day I still don't type “correctly” (my left hand takes more keys than it's supposed to), but I can type faster and more accurately than almost everyone.

Heh, I learned the same way. I used the hunt and peck method probably up until freshmen year of High School. I got incredibly fast at it, so that it was never really a problem. Then one day I looked up from the keyboard and realized my fingers instinctually knew where the keys were. One advantage is that I can type entirely with my right or left hand, if need be, because both know where all the keys are.

Oh, that's harsh. This makes it easier to understand why you're as well put-together as you are. Most people our age are not, and, among the few who are, many have some traumatic event in their past which helped them to focus their lives. (Not me, though, if you're wondering...)

I don't really know if I'd call it traumatic, but aye, it was formative. Though I'd generally say writing has contributed far more to me being "well put-together" than that experience, which ranks around 3rd place (2nd place going to reading, if you are curious).

Actually, I've been writing extensively (though not as much as you, from the sound of it) for so much of my life that I actually think better when I write than otherwise. Writing is thinking, for me, and thinking is writing.



I'm curious; with so many writers of varying skill levels, might anyone be interesting in starting a writing group here on the compendium?



Since I mentioned it in my first post, let me follow up by saying that I still can't call myself a writing. But... I've taken very important steps in getting there once again. Time and workspace have been limiting factors in the past few years, and solutions to those two issues have been devised. I just need a free Saturday to implement them. Then I can try out my newest character idea (writing from a female perspective; something, I realized, I haven't ever done before).

Boo the Gentleman Caller

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #18 on: April 01, 2009, 09:38:52 pm »
I am forcing myself to take an hour out of each day and write.  Even if that means staying up a little longer than normal or waking up a little earlier.

And so far it's causing me to have great progress, and I'm loving what I'm doing.  I'm two weeks into this script and 25+ pages through.  And I'm talking solid stuff, here; not first draft.

So setting aside time deliberately away for writing is helping me with my writing fix.  I barricade myself away, and if Britt's awake (Britt is my wife, by the way), I tell her that I have to be alone for a little while to write and listen to music.  She doesn't like it, but she understands.

So just write.

teaflower

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #19 on: April 01, 2009, 09:53:12 pm »
So I recently took my writing dreams to the next level. I contacted a literary agent in hopes that he'd at least take a look at 'The End of the Worlds', and potentially help me get it published and such. It is one of my many dreams, and hopefully it will be done.

When I want to write, sometimes I find myself with the wireless adapter lying useless on my desk, so that I don't have to avoid the internet. I just can't get there. I close my door tightly and just listen to music. Music I can't understand. Music with words I don't know (one of the many reasons I keep a collection of Japanese music on my computer, as well as the occasional German or other weird language) or music with no words at all (fan of orchestrated stuff, but video game music makes up a majority of my playlist). I'll write as much as I can until I just can't anymore.

FouCapitan

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #20 on: April 02, 2009, 03:48:25 am »
I think you replied to the wrong topic Setheus.

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Forums/index.php/topic,7222.0.html

Thought

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #21 on: April 02, 2009, 02:51:43 pm »
A little something I just came across that I thought might interest potential writers here: Orson Scott Card reviews Malcolm Gladwell's book Outliers: The Story of Success

Its about a third of the way down the page, if you are looking.

But what was so interesting were a few concepts that can be summed up here, I think.

1) If that book that OSC reviewed is to be believed, it generally takes an investment of about 10,000 hours to really succeed in your chosen field.

2) If you believe the reviewer (OSC himself), you will learn more about writing from producing a 100,000-word novel than from any class or classes.

3) Again, if you believe the reviewer, every writer has to produce ten thousand pages of pure drivel (though he leaves as to when this is produced open).

This is a bit of random information, but hopefully it will inspire a few of us.

Setheus

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #22 on: April 02, 2009, 03:48:54 pm »
I think you replied to the wrong topic Setheus.

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Forums/index.php/topic,7222.0.html

Yea. . . I deserve a  :picardno

Have no idea how that happened
Sorry >.<

placidchap

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #23 on: April 02, 2009, 04:03:59 pm »
I think you replied to the wrong topic Setheus.

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Forums/index.php/topic,7222.0.html

Yea. . . I deserve a  :picardno

Have no idea how that happened
Sorry >.<

Just delete the original post...it will be as if it never happened.

teaflower

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #24 on: April 02, 2009, 04:45:08 pm »
Literary agent did not go so well. Got generic rejection letter. But hey, I put myself out there! He read it and he replied promptly. I'm going to keep looking into the process of publication, but I can't do self publication. I lack money. Does anyone have any tips for me?

Ramsus

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #25 on: April 02, 2009, 04:53:25 pm »
Look up some publishers in the latest Writer's Market you can find in your local library, send out copies of your manuscript to editors, try to get some feedback, make some changes if they ask for them, and repeat until you get published.

Alternatively, start a new, modern book-publishing empire built around an on-demand, digital-typesetting based publishing infrastructure that can print any type of book in your catalog at any time and doesn't waste money on storage or warehousing.

EDIT: And yes, your manuscript will probably get ignored by a lot of people you send it to, but hopefully you'll eventually get some feedback. Just read through the first part of the Writer's Market book on how to submit manuscripts and look up any relevant information on getting published that you can find, maybe get to know a few writers and talk to them about their experiences getting published, and keep trying.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2009, 04:59:14 pm by Ramsus »

teaflower

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #26 on: April 02, 2009, 05:20:45 pm »
All the more reason to find my sister's copy of it. She wanted to get published, so she got that. She gave up on it. I won't. Not now, at least. I've worked so hard... I can't let my efforts go essentially wasted. Thank you very much for the advice, Ramsus. I'll make sure to follow through on that. Nathan Bransford (the agent I contacted) doesn't know what he's missing!

Thought

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #27 on: April 02, 2009, 06:09:47 pm »
It can also depend on the genre you are writing for. At least for Science Fiction I had been told (almost around 7 years ago now) that one needed to build a name by publishing a few short stories before an agent or a publisher would even look at a query letter.

Delta Dragon

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #28 on: April 03, 2009, 10:22:40 pm »
It can also depend on the genre you are writing for. At least for Science Fiction I had been told (almost around 7 years ago now) that one needed to build a name by publishing a few short stories before an agent or a publisher would even look at a query letter.
Dang.  Because if I ever do write novels Sci fi would be the ones I would write most.

Boo the Gentleman Caller

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Re: The Thread for Writers
« Reply #29 on: April 03, 2009, 11:58:55 pm »
I have a friend who is in the process of publishing a fantasy trilogy, and she said right now is an awful time to try and get fantasy published.  Fantasy is "in" right now due to the now-subsiding Harry Potter/Chronicles of Narnia/Lord of the Rings craze.  As such, there are many many fantasy authors trying to get their stuff out there.  And seeing that the fantasy craze is, as I've said, subsiding, it's a difficult situation to be in.

However, that doesn't mean you should give up.  NEVER give up.  Seriously.  Chase you dreams until there's nothing left.  Never give up; never surrender!