Author Topic: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger in Top 100 Games Ever  (Read 9531 times)

Schala Zeal

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« Last Edit: November 20, 2012, 01:04:22 am by Princess Schala Zeal »

skylark

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2012, 02:18:37 am »
What?! 52?!

Those shortsighted... :roll: *walks away*

utunnels

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2012, 03:12:34 am »
Quote
Chrono Trigger‘s epic time-hopping story was pretty ridiculous and its combat system – cribbed from Final Fantasy IV – was arguably second-rate

 :cry:

xcalibur

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2012, 09:49:12 am »
yikes @ that quote. The author shouldn't make sweeping judgments when he has no idea what he's talking about.

also, Chrono Trigger should be somewhere in the top 10.

utunnels

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2012, 11:12:40 am »
Now I'm wondering what is the similarity between FF4 and CT's combat system.

Dual tech? ATB system? Menu placement?

FaustWolf

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2012, 11:15:03 am »
Yeah, they probably saw the ATB bars and assumed it was the same. Yikes! Few games have outdone the Chrono Trigger battle system, with those yummy double and triple techs.

It's still pretty exciting to see it mentioned in Time Magazine. Thanks for finding this PSZ!

skylark

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2012, 12:34:53 pm »
Let me guess.

#1 was Halo? Call of Duty? Madden?!

*groan*

HeadlessFritz

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2012, 01:18:52 pm »
52 ?? And where the heck is Ocarina of Time ? Did they recycle the guy who did the top 100 movies :)

Molotov

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2012, 02:25:03 pm »
Quote
Chrono Trigger‘s epic time-hopping story was pretty ridiculous and its combat system – cribbed from Final Fantasy IV – was arguably second-rate

To be fair, the first part of this quote is accurate and the second part isn't completely wrong. The story was pretty much "hur, teenagers beat up giant monster and save the world + time travel." Yeah it had some other details, but I've honestly never understood how people give the game so much credit when only one person on your entire team had any real depth. I'm a bitter Cross fanboy though, so take that how you will.

As for the battle system, it's extremely simple when you really look at it. Very few fights that I can remember have any sort of tricks to them (like Slash on Masamune), so the rest are literally just "use your strongest techs and refill MP and HP as necessary." Not an uncommon thing to happen with an RPG battle system I'm sure, but it's basic enough that I don't see why anybody would actually like the darn thing. The double/triple techs are neat, but since you can't directly move your team on the field, they just seem like extra flashy versions of the "use your strongest techs" part.

Anyway, I'm not bothered that much by the placement on the list. Top <number> lists are stupid anyway, but there's no way in heck this game should come anywhere close to the top 10. I would've put it higher than 52 though.

Schala Zeal

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #9 on: November 18, 2012, 02:40:17 pm »
Yeah, they probably saw the ATB bars and assumed it was the same. Yikes! Few games have outdone the Chrono Trigger battle system, with those yummy double and triple techs.

It's still pretty exciting to see it mentioned in Time Magazine. Thanks for finding this PSZ!

Well, I'm just glad to have not pointed out something that's been here before, for once.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2012, 09:13:07 pm by Princess Schala Zeal »

Xenterex

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2012, 10:53:57 pm »
how do you figure that its ranked #52?  I don't see any particular number placement on the games outside of a series of links that are mostly arrayed in chronological order.  Yea, at the 90's section in particular not all of them are in directly chronological order, but placement of the games as a whole certainly falls into that order and I don't see any qualifier that one decade is better than another.

From what I've gleaned from the skim, they don't put a particular number on the games, don't express much of an opinion, just a line or two about a reminder of the game, and then move on.  It feels about the least in-depth a list I've seen given from Time. 

Schala Zeal

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2012, 11:21:13 pm »
Eh... I made an assumption because it was on page 53, minus the first page

xcalibur

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2012, 07:33:18 am »
Quote
Chrono Trigger‘s epic time-hopping story was pretty ridiculous and its combat system – cribbed from Final Fantasy IV – was arguably second-rate

To be fair, the first part of this quote is accurate and the second part isn't completely wrong. The story was pretty much "hur, teenagers beat up giant monster and save the world + time travel." Yeah it had some other details, but I've honestly never understood how people give the game so much credit when only one person on your entire team had any real depth. I'm a bitter Cross fanboy though, so take that how you will.

As for the battle system, it's extremely simple when you really look at it. Very few fights that I can remember have any sort of tricks to them (like Slash on Masamune), so the rest are literally just "use your strongest techs and refill MP and HP as necessary." Not an uncommon thing to happen with an RPG battle system I'm sure, but it's basic enough that I don't see why anybody would actually like the darn thing. The double/triple techs are neat, but since you can't directly move your team on the field, they just seem like extra flashy versions of the "use your strongest techs" part.

Anyway, I'm not bothered that much by the placement on the list. Top <number> lists are stupid anyway, but there's no way in heck this game should come anywhere close to the top 10. I would've put it higher than 52 though.

I guess by your way of looking at it, FF4 was: hur, various people beat up a giant monster and save the world + space travel
FF5: hur, various people beat up a giant tree and save existence
FF6: hur, various people defeat a maniac tyrant and save what's left of the world + magic gremlins
Legend of Zelda series: hur, an elf boy beats up a giant pig and saves hyrule + triangles

Chrono Trigger had brilliant storytelling, and alot of depth beneath the humorous, cheerful surface. and the battle system is one of the better turn-based battle systems I've played. there was definitely strategy involved in a number of fights. it also had little to do with FF4 battle system except that they both had a menu.

I honestly question whether you've even played through CT. Like the author, you shouldn't comment on things when you don't know what you're talking about.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2012, 07:35:53 am by xcalibur »

Molotov

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2012, 02:55:33 pm »
Actually, your descriptions of Final Fantasy IV, VI, and Zelda sound kind of accurate to me (not familiar enough with V to comment). :P

In all seriousness though, I'm aware that there's a bit more backstory to those games, but that's really what they boil down to. I'm aware that Chrono Trigger has backstory of its own since I used to play it as a kid, but I should point out that character development is what I'm most interested in. I've always considered the entire cast outside of Magus to be extremely flat, which by the way, is why I always find Cross complaints about character development to be massively ironic.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I've always considered the Zeal stuff to be Magus development more than anything else. I don't particularly remember anything in that Undersea Palace business that really changed the "teenagers destroy giant monster and save the world" part. Maybe it's just me, but I would've been more forgiving of the plot if something along the way changed the end goal even slightly from the first time you see Lavos on the computer monitor. Like maybe Lavos wasn't this completely evil creature or something, I don't know.

But anyway, I'm sure this is something we'll have to just agree to disagree on. I just honestly think too many people have their nostalgia glasses on when it comes to Chrono Trigger and there's nothing I can do to change that. I appreciate that the author of that article didn't give it an overly generous spot because it at least hints that there's no filter at work like I'd expect on a great number of other lists.

The same goes for the battle system comment. I personally don't see any strategy involved in the game unless you're doing a challenge or speed run of some kind, because otherwise you'll probably be leveled up enough and with good enough gear that you can do exactly what I mentioned in my first post. Lavos might give you a little grief I guess, but nothing some armor upgrades won't solve. I just don't like the simplicity of it all, you know?

As for the last part, I find that a bit insulting. Just because I don't have as high regard for it as you do doesn't mean that I've never played it. Some things just don't click with people or just lose their appeal over time. In my case, this was the latter. The more I started playing Chrono Cross (and reading all the unfair hate), the more I started to appreciate the stuff that it did so much better than Trigger. I guess by playing it so much, I took off my nostalgia glasses (which I assure you, I had) and started to realize Trigger wasn't everything I thought it was as a kid. Is that so bad?

And just to be totally clear, nowhere in there did I say Chrono Trigger is a bad game. I just said it's not top 10 material. It's an enjoyable game and something I think any RPG player should try, but nothing more.

Xenterex

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Re: Time Magazine ranks Chrono Trigger #52 in Top 100 Games Ever
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2012, 06:05:09 pm »
Having read through several other article descriptions from that list, though not in its entirety, the chrono entry does seem the most awkward I've seen listed.  Many games had their historical nod in how they were innovative for the time, did something really well, and/or even heavily influenced games to come and insinuated why a particular entry was listed and not others, or not the entire series of that line.  Other entries have inclusions for sales figures and a couple other de facto attempts to an objective purpose for that entry.

And then Trigger is on there because it has a religious fan-following of effectual losers and had music "mostly" done by one particular individual.  Yea, thats not a bitter article or anything at all.  The other qualms/faults I'd seen in other articles were at least tongue and cheek, so I kinda wonder if the one who wrote that entry has a beef with Trigger and/or the Compendium.