Author Topic: Crono = Jesus and other parallels to the Bible  (Read 1244 times)

Lavos

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Crono = Jesus and other parallels to the Bible
« on: September 14, 2011, 10:03:44 am »
Yeah, I've read Chrono Testament. I just felt that it didn't expand enough on the connection. Here's my attempt at expanding the connection:

The most obvious parallel:

Crono=Jesus

  • Crono has power over Holy in the Japanese version: this was probably changed to Light because it would be too controversial for American audiences
  • Crono dies an unjust death (being lasered to death by Lavos is a pretty sucky death, isn't it)
  • Crono is resurrected
  • Crono's resurrection and Easter share some themes (Easter is usually associated with the Easter Bunny and eggs: Crono is revived by an egg)
  • Crono saves mankind (by defeating Lavos)

Now, think about it. Crono didn't just save mankind from Lavos: he redeemed it by defeating the Queen of Zeal. Think about it: Jesus was indirectly slain by human error/sin, and what is the greatest sin? Pride. What is the ultimate symbol of pride in CT? Zeal. Gaspar states:

"That poor woman can finally rest, now that the Black Omen is gone... She's reverted back to a human.."

See? If Crono didn't step in, Queen Zeal would have lived forever in Lavos' eternal nightmare: she states it herself at one point in the game. It is stated in the game that Queen Zeal was once a kind and just ruler before Lavos' influence basically turned her into magical Saren. Thus, I think that Queen Zeal represents humanity as a whole. But where does Lavos fit in all this?

This is simple: Lavos represents sin.

Queen Zeal is corrupted by Lavos, in the same way that humanity as a whole is corrupted by sin.
Crono defeats Lavos and saves mankind as a whole from the hellish future that is 2300 AD and Zeal from the corruption of Lavos.

(And frankly, I know I used "sin" too much: anyone who makes FFX jokes will be shot.)



Synchronization

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Re: Crono = Jesus and other parallels to the Bible
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2011, 08:17:34 am »
I'd also add to this: Schala as Mary Magdalene, Queen Zeal as Judas, and I suppose Magus can cameo as John the Baptist.

MagilsugaM

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Re: Crono = Jesus and other parallels to the Bible
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2011, 09:08:29 am »

I know you used "sin" too much. But if you think about it. Both Tidus and Crono are kind of like Jesus too in a way. Except Tidus disappears(stays dead). I am not trying to compare too much here.
You do have a point though, Crono being a Messiah that saves the world from the Apocalypse kinda makes sense. I wouldn't go around calling him Jesus though, that's kinda blasphemy. xD

tushantin

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Re: Crono = Jesus and other parallels to the Bible
« Reply #3 on: September 23, 2011, 08:09:09 pm »
Jesus could walk on water. SIR CRONO CAN WALK ON JESUS!

Jquestionmark

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Re: Crono = Jesus and other parallels to the Bible
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2011, 05:51:24 pm »
Honestly, I've always felt that comparing Crono to Jesus is an enormous stretch, and the parallels are mostly coincidental or projected onto the game instead of actually or intentionally present. There are a few leaps in logic here I don't quite agree with.

  • Crono has power over Holy in the Japanese version: this was probably changed to Light because it would be too controversial for American audiences

Presuming Holy or Light to be exclusively related to Christianity is unsupported, especially in a game originating in a country where Christianity was not a major religion for most of its history. People in the CT universe have different elemental associations, and while Crono is the only playable character to have that association, why would we not expect other people in that setting to have Holy association?

  • Crono dies an unjust death (being lasered to death by Lavos is a pretty sucky death, isn't it)

I think a glorious death in battle has more in common with Norse or other religions from more warlike cultures than it does with crucifixion. Not that he even actually dies. If I recall correctly, the party grabs him away the moment before he dies. A doll is destroyed, but Crono himself is unharmed, and most certainly not dead.

  • Crono is resurrected

As I just said, Crono never dies, he's removed from the situation a moment before he's killed. No resurrection takes place in this series of events. You can project the idea of resurrection onto it, but within the game's world, there's no magic to it, just a powerful technological temporal device that makes it possible to change the perceived flow of events at one point in time. Unlike other portions of the game where the timeline is changed, there's not even an actual change that occurs here, just an opportunity to see what actually occurs in a single frozen moment of time that only the party can interact with. No resurrection, no Jesus parallel. This is far more Doctor Who than it is Biblical.

  • Crono's resurrection and Easter share some themes (Easter is usually associated with the Easter Bunny and eggs: Crono is revived by an egg)

You are aware that the association of rabbits and eggs with Easter is due to the co-opted pagan traditions and has nothing to do with Christianity? The Time Egg is a piece of technology, and any association it may have with Easter by virtue of being an egg does not support comparison of Crono to Jesus.

  • Crono saves mankind (by defeating Lavos)

As does everyone else in the party. Besides, Jesus doing any sort of saving mankind is highly subjective and debatable.

Now, think about it. Crono didn't just save mankind from Lavos: he redeemed it by defeating the Queen of Zeal. Think about it: Jesus was indirectly slain by human error/sin, and what is the greatest sin? Pride. What is the ultimate symbol of pride in CT? Zeal. Gaspar states:

"That poor woman can finally rest, now that the Black Omen is gone... She's reverted back to a human.."

See? If Crono didn't step in, Queen Zeal would have lived forever in Lavos' eternal nightmare: she states it herself at one point in the game. It is stated in the game that Queen Zeal was once a kind and just ruler before Lavos' influence basically turned her into magical Saren. Thus, I think that Queen Zeal represents humanity as a whole. But where does Lavos fit in all this?

This is simple: Lavos represents sin.

Queen Zeal is corrupted by Lavos, in the same way that humanity as a whole is corrupted by sin.
Crono defeats Lavos and saves mankind as a whole from the hellish future that is 2300 AD and Zeal from the corruption of Lavos.

(And frankly, I know I used "sin" too much: anyone who makes FFX jokes will be shot.)

I'd argue about the any sin being greater than any other, but more importantly, I don't think Zeal's meant to represent humanity in any way. She's just an individual corrupted by her own inherent drives and sudden access to power. The external force of Lavos made such a thing possible, but it was her decision to wield the power in such a way, and not some external force that caused her to. This isn't about Lavos being sin, it's about individuals having the potential to do wrong, but not necessarily the opportunity.

Lavos isn't a representation of sin, it's a creature that exists on a different scale than we do, simply trying to survive. He is not evil, or some corrupting force any more so than real world diseases are. They may be bad to us, but looking at the bigger picture, they are simply creatures trying to survive. Comparing life in general to the concept of sin seems a little far fetched.

xcalibur

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Re: Crono = Jesus and other parallels to the Bible
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2011, 04:36:25 am »
I could definitely see Chrono as a Christ-like figure. It may not have been intentional, but the comparison can easily be made.

Quote
Presuming Holy or Light to be exclusively related to Christianity is unsupported, especially in a game originating in a country where Christianity was not a major religion for most of its history. People in the CT universe have different elemental associations, and while Crono is the only playable character to have that association, why would we not expect other people in that setting to have Holy association?

It's not exclusively related to Christianity. But Chrono having the power of "Heavens" does support an association with a holy or messianic figure.

Quote
I think a glorious death in battle has more in common with Norse or other religions from more warlike cultures than it does with crucifixion. Not that he even actually dies. If I recall correctly, the party grabs him away the moment before he dies. A doll is destroyed, but Crono himself is unharmed, and most certainly not dead.

true. but one thing to keep in mind is that he sacrificed himself to defend his friends against Lavos, when he knew he couldn't win.

Quote
As I just said, Crono never dies, he's removed from the situation a moment before he's killed. No resurrection takes place in this series of events. You can project the idea of resurrection onto it, but within the game's world, there's no magic to it, just a powerful technological temporal device that makes it possible to change the perceived flow of events at one point in time. Unlike other portions of the game where the timeline is changed, there's not even an actual change that occurs here, just an opportunity to see what actually occurs in a single frozen moment of time that only the party can interact with. No resurrection, no Jesus parallel. This is far more Doctor Who than it is Biblical.

in the final timeline of the game, this is correct. But in the storyline with Time Travelers Immunity, he is killed at first. There is a portion of the game when he is not there. The Chrono Trigger is used to alter the timeline in a special way, so that Chrono is brought back and his death is cancelled out to the Darkness Beyond Time. Maybe it wasn't technically resurrection, but for storyline purposes it was highly similar.

Quote
You are aware that the association of rabbits and eggs with Easter is due to the co-opted pagan traditions and has nothing to do with Christianity? The Time Egg is a piece of technology, and any association it may have with Easter by virtue of being an egg does not support comparison of Crono to Jesus.

true, but it is another coincidental overlap.

Quote
As does everyone else in the party. Besides, Jesus doing any sort of saving mankind is highly subjective and debatable.

Whether or not Jesus saved mankind, he is heralded for doing so. Chrono and his disciples face down Lavos, who can be compared to death, and conquered it. Likewise, Jesus is known as the one person who conquered death to bring everlasting life, or so the story goes.