Author Topic: Just a Lazy Port?  (Read 3127 times)

Razig

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Re: Just a Lazy Port?
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2020, 06:55:53 pm »
There are a few spots where the new translation adds some actual clarity (most notably, fixing Gaspar's "Find this person...fast." line) but for the most part I find it rather dry, and in places, terribly stilted.

Check out the attachments for an example. "You must stop my lady mother!" Who speaks with such formality during an emergency? This is potentially the end of the world we're talking about, not some petty foofaraw at court.

Another example:

Quote from: Algetty Elder
When the disaster struck, an eerie black portal
materialized before young Lord Janus. Melchior tried
to save the boy prince, but succeeded only in getting
himself dragged in as well.

Good thing he clarifies that it's "young" Lord Janus he's talking about, or we might have thought he meant that other Lord Janus. And just to remove any ambiguity, he further clarifies that it's the boy prince, instead of the adult prince or the girl prince.

Sheiken

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Re: Just a Lazy Port?
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2020, 07:35:15 pm »
Both translations have their perks.  I loved Frog's accent and was sad to see it go for example.  Some lines certainly do come across smoother with the old translation as well, but then there are others that make more sense in the DS translation as well.  Like when Crono and gang party hard with Ayla, it makes much more sense that they wake up hung over from drinking (DS version) than it does where they wake up with a "tummy ache" from eating too much (SNES version).  Over all the translation preferences are mostly subjective outside of a few examples however, and I feel nostalgia plays into that.  And that is totally fine, no one is taking anything away from the SNES translation.

I guess the way I look at it is if anything is contradictory between the two translations as far as canon, the DS translation would be the correct one automatically as it is a more 1:1 conversion of the original Japanese script,  and therefore more in line with the creator's vision.  This makes the DS translation better by default to me, despite my love for the SNES script.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2020, 08:44:18 pm by Sheiken »

Acacia Sgt

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Re: Just a Lazy Port?
« Reply #17 on: January 04, 2020, 08:40:50 pm »
There are a few spots where the new translation adds some actual clarity (most notably, fixing Gaspar's "Find this person...fast." line) but for the most part I find it rather dry, and in places, terribly stilted.

Check out the attachments for an example. "You must stop my lady mother!" Who speaks with such formality during an emergency? This is potentially the end of the world we're talking about, not some petty foofaraw at court.

Another example:

Quote from: Algetty Elder
When the disaster struck, an eerie black portal
materialized before young Lord Janus. Melchior tried
to save the boy prince, but succeeded only in getting
himself dragged in as well.

Good thing he clarifies that it's "young" Lord Janus he's talking about, or we might have thought he meant that other Lord Janus. And just to remove any ambiguity, he further clarifies that it's the boy prince, instead of the adult prince or the girl prince.

Personally, in those cases I feel they're just speaking with formality. Which makes sense when one is a princess and the other is a village elder. As for who would speak with such formality in an emergency... well, how do you know Schala wouldn't? How many emergencies has she been present for to believe that the habit of formal speech should've long been suppressed. This is likely the just the first she's actively involved with. The time to say just one more word is at most just a fraction of a second of time more than without.

Complaining he overly describes Janus out of formality feels more like nitpicking, as well.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2020, 08:41:52 pm by Acacia Sgt »

Lavos, a one-eyed tick

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Re: Just a Lazy Port?
« Reply #18 on: January 04, 2020, 10:07:43 pm »
Steam save bug got fixed, but there's still bugs preventing you from seeing how much items cost.
The anime cutscenes are terrible because they are often forced upon you, defy the original designs, (Look at how they butchered Lavos. Barely any spikes. No eye, no intimidating, red, spiral-y mouth textures. Instead they made him look like a dried sponge with a rim of spikes... And in that cutscene they also made Janus smile while telling Crono he was going to die... So out of character and random)
Plus the rehashed, uncreative Toriyama designs really stand out, especially with Glenn.
They honestly DID fix a lot with the translation and I'll give credit where credit is due. But I dislike the renaming of some enemies and some items... Things like "Ruminator" are still much more intimidating than "Hydraconda". (However the "heal" item being renamed was appreciated, lol) It also reads much more like a written script while the SNES translation felt more like natural spoken words for the most part. I was fine with Frog's accent leaving too, that is actually a big improvement on the DS' part. Dimensional Vortex was fun too, I agree. Nice having some new hard bosses, too. And the ending was sad and interesting.
I just really dislike them slapping the anime cutscene on you first because it really ruins the simplicity pendulum intro by forcing something else in front of it, and even a quick tap or button press still is rather annoying. The sound differences aren't as noticeable, except for when the synths are off or PSX samples are being used instead of more SNES-like ones.
Seriously, listen to the DS and the SNES versions of Zeal, Undersea, and Last Battle and tell me the DS didn't butcher the synths. Honestly, check out Mathew Valente's video on the SNES-PSX-DS music comparisons, it is very interesting and can help give you a lot more insight onto this stuff.
The big screen is actually VERY appreciated from my standing. I don't like having to cram my focus to a small screen to see what's going on.
I also talked to a few people in the past about this topic, so I'll share what they have to say.
One person I know played a version of the game with the DS translation, then went back and played the PSX, and actually preferred the old translation. I don't actually know why, but I think it's interesting how the "better" translation is immediately cast aside by an unbiased opinion about the game. Another person I know would vouch for the SNES as the best because it's best to see how something was originally meant to be made first, even if something later is said to improve on it. Would you rather watch the original Star Wars trilogy or the later rerelease with unnecessary "improvements" by the creators?
Both translations have their strengths and faults, and I'm not sure if I would be able to choose one if I really had to. But comparing is interesting. Anyone else have anything to add about that, I'm invested and interested in this conversation.

Sheiken

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Re: Just a Lazy Port?
« Reply #19 on: January 04, 2020, 10:30:14 pm »
Steam save bug got fixed, but there's still bugs preventing you from seeing how much items cost.
The anime cutscenes are terrible because they are often forced upon you, defy the original designs, (Look at how they butchered Lavos. Barely any spikes. No eye, no intimidating, red, spiral-y mouth textures. Instead they made him look like a dried sponge with a rim of spikes... And in that cutscene they also made Janus smile while telling Crono he was going to die... So out of character and random)
Plus the rehashed, uncreative Toriyama designs really stand out, especially with Glenn.
They honestly DID fix a lot with the translation and I'll give credit where credit is due. But I dislike the renaming of some enemies and some items... Things like "Ruminator" are still much more intimidating than "Hydraconda". (However the "heal" item being renamed was appreciated, lol) It also reads much more like a written script while the SNES translation felt more like natural spoken words for the most part. I was fine with Frog's accent leaving too, that is actually a big improvement on the DS' part. Dimensional Vortex was fun too, I agree. Nice having some new hard bosses, too. And the ending was sad and interesting.
I just really dislike them slapping the anime cutscene on you first because it really ruins the simplicity pendulum intro by forcing something else in front of it, and even a quick tap or button press still is rather annoying. The sound differences aren't as noticeable, except for when the synths are off or PSX samples are being used instead of more SNES-like ones.
Seriously, listen to the DS and the SNES versions of Zeal, Undersea, and Last Battle and tell me the DS didn't butcher the synths. Honestly, check out Mathew Valente's video on the SNES-PSX-DS music comparisons, it is very interesting and can help give you a lot more insight onto this stuff.
The big screen is actually VERY appreciated from my standing. I don't like having to cram my focus to a small screen to see what's going on.
I also talked to a few people in the past about this topic, so I'll share what they have to say.
One person I know played a version of the game with the DS translation, then went back and played the PSX, and actually preferred the old translation. I don't actually know why, but I think it's interesting how the "better" translation is immediately cast aside by an unbiased opinion about the game. Another person I know would vouch for the SNES as the best because it's best to see how something was originally meant to be made first, even if something later is said to improve on it. Would you rather watch the original Star Wars trilogy or the later rerelease with unnecessary "improvements" by the creators?
Both translations have their strengths and faults, and I'm not sure if I would be able to choose one if I really had to. But comparing is interesting. Anyone else have anything to add about that, I'm invested and interested in this conversation.

This is a fair post, although I feel like you are letting the cutscenes get to you a little more than they should, especially the opening.  Glenn's original design was definitely butchered though, I will give you that.  My only real complaint is how out of place they are, but as something that can be turned off I just enjoyed them for what they were.  I still lol when I have them on and Frog cuts open the mountain twice.  The ending cutscene (Glenn excluded) I feel was very well done overall.  TBH they could have probably done with the opening and ending scene being the only two in the game.

As for someone going back and likeing the old translation better, it is still a subjective thing even when nostalgia is not a factor.  I just feel a lot of the time it is a key factor.  However neither version is objectively "bad", I just tend to side with the more accurate translation.  I am someone who hates localization changes, so for me the DS wins out, which is why I called it objectively better.  They both have quality writing though, to the point where "objectively" is used very loosely to begin with.

Glad to hear they fixed the save point issue.  It was honestly the biggest issue that still remained.  Chrono Trigger is not a hard game, but if you did die at the wrong time, it would suck going back potentially three save points because of said bug.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2020, 01:34:54 pm by Sheiken »

Lavos, a one-eyed tick

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Re: Just a Lazy Port?
« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2020, 11:48:50 am »
Well, as someone who is known as Lavos, Lavos being butchered in the cutscenes does hurt a bit, haha. I honestly dislike the opening but the ending scene, apart from Glenn is fantastic, and the music medley is good too.
I'd honestly love to hold a poll to see opinions about the translations to see who prefers what and why at some point.

Schala Zeal

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Re: Just a Lazy Port?
« Reply #21 on: February 06, 2020, 05:50:28 am »
Well, I do know the Steam port has a Ted Woosley dialogue mod.