Chrono Trigger DS Analysis HQ (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)

[Dream Devourer]

Ah, how did the folks in Medina Village call Magus in SFC/PS version?

Now they call him 'fiendlord', which is quite interesting, because his Japanese name '魔王' means EXACTLY 'fiendlord'.

Also I checked the Japanese dialogue of a certain NPC, he says '魔王樣' (maou sama), if you translate it back, it should probably be 'Lord Magus'. And in English script, he just says 'fiendlord', interesting...

Mao/Maoh/Maou means "demon lord" or "dark king", so fiendlord is a pretty accurate title. With Mao being a title one could also assume his English name is also actually a title, Magus being the singular of Magi.

@ Dark Serge and Shadow D. Darkman,
I suppose that's true.

---

Also, if Chrono Cross is just the result of one of the endings (or rather multiple ones...), could we assume Radical Dreamers is that as well? If so, what ending would be the most logical to predate RD?

[Shadow D. Darkman]

Ah, how did the folks in Medina Village call Magus in SFC/PS version?

Now they call him 'fiendlord', which is quite interesting, because his Japanese name '魔王' means EXACTLY 'fiendlord'.

Also I checked the Japanese dialogue of a certain NPC, he says '魔王樣' (maou sama), if you translate it back, it should probably be 'Lord Magus'. And in English script, he just says 'fiendlord', interesting...

Mao/Maoh/Maou means "demon lord" or "dark king", so fiendlord is a pretty accurate title. With Mao being a title one could also assume his English name is also actually a title, Magus being the singular of Magi.

@ Dark Serge and Shadow D. Darkman,
I suppose that's true.

---

Also, if Chrono Cross is just the result of one of the endings (or rather multiple ones...), could we assume Radical Dreamers is that as well? If so, what ending would be the most logical to predate RD?

Any of the endings in which Crono was NOT resurrected on Death Peak.

[FaustWolf]

Arc Impulse has reported this in response to the supposition that Eclipse Magus didn't travel with Crono & co, so everyone take notice:

？？？「ここには、もうラヴォスはいない。
ここはすでにラヴォスが倒された
未来の時空だ。
俺たちがヤツを滅ぼした。

???: Lavos is no longer here.
This is a future timespace where
Lavos has already been defeated.
We destroyed him.
[I find it curious that this future(?) Magus refers to himself throughout this ending as 'ore'--
Magus in the rest of CT refers to himself as 'watashi' everywhere but a single scene.]

Ｍａｇｕｓ「もっとも、お前たちが
やってきた世界で
俺たちが手を組んでいたかどうかは
知らぬがな。

Magus: Although I don't know
whether or not I joined forces
with you, in the world you come from.
[He said this to me with Magus in my party, so I assume he says the same thing no matter what.]

...I think the Japanese version all but explicitly tells us that Eclipse Magus did indeed join up with Crono's party.  The fact that he says "we" defeated Lavos -- in a language where you only bother using the plural when you're making a specific point -- and the line about "I don't know whether I joined up with you guys in your world" heavily implies "but I did join up with you in my world."  To me this seems like the biggest oversight in the English adaptation -- the translator/adaptor got all caught up in making Magus sound all kewl and philosophical and deep as they consistently do throughout CTDS, and accidentally obscured this specific fact in the process.

I was actually starting to really like the idea of Eclipse Magus coming from an unknown alternate dimension, so can the backers come up with some kind of theoretical rebuttal?

[Magus22]

Perhaps... but I have something somewhat tied into this with whatever relevance it may have still puzzles me...

Why is this Magus (Eclipse) in his prophet attire?

[Shadow D. Darkman]

Perhaps... but I have something somewhat tied into this with whatever relevance it may have still puzzles me...

Why is this Magus (Eclipse) in his prophet attire?

Probably just the sprite. It's possible he may be wearing a plain cloak in the actual scene.

[maggiekarp]

Magus is in his Prophet garb because they've been reusing sprites and music for all the new features and it's nice and generically mysterious. Don't they use Johnny's theme for when Dalton shows up? Does that mean Dalton's really a robot biker from the future?

...You put down those sequel storyboards RIGHT NOW, KATO!

[Acacia Sgt]

Magus is in his Prophet garb because they've been reusing sprites and music for all the new features and it's nice and generically mysterious. Don't they use Johnny's theme for when Dalton shows up? Does that mean Dalton's really a robot biker from the future?

...You put down those sequel storyboards RIGHT NOW, KATO!

Yeah, that probably is the reason.

[Romana]

Magus is in his Prophet garb because they've been reusing sprites and music for all the new features and it's nice and generically mysterious. Don't they use Johnny's theme for when Dalton shows up? Does that mean Dalton's really a robot biker from the future?

...You put down those sequel storyboards RIGHT NOW, KATO!

At least it wasn't Burn! Bobonga or something. But seriously, Johnny's theme...? It's like cheap porno music.

[Dark Serge]

Magus is in his Prophet garb because they've been reusing sprites and music for all the new features and it's nice and generically mysterious. Don't they use Johnny's theme for when Dalton shows up? Does that mean Dalton's really a robot biker from the future?

...You put down those sequel storyboards RIGHT NOW, KATO!

At least it wasn't Burn! Bobonga or something. But seriously, Johnny's theme...? It's like cheap porno music.

I thought it kinda fitted him. Dalton does need his own theme though. That music when he takes flight on the Epoch was alright, but it could be even better.

Oh well, if there's gonna be a new installment, Dalton will surely play a role in that.

[Eske]

Arc Impulse has reported this in response to the supposition that Eclipse Magus didn't travel with Crono & co, so everyone take notice:

？？？「ここには、もうラヴォスはいない。
ここはすでにラヴォスが倒された
未来の時空だ。
俺たちがヤツを滅ぼした。

???: Lavos is no longer here.
This is a future timespace where
Lavos has already been defeated.
We destroyed him.
[I find it curious that this future(?) Magus refers to himself throughout this ending as 'ore'--
Magus in the rest of CT refers to himself as 'watashi' everywhere but a single scene.]

Ｍａｇｕｓ「もっとも、お前たちが
やってきた世界で
俺たちが手を組んでいたかどうかは
知らぬがな。

Magus: Although I don't know
whether or not I joined forces
with you, in the world you come from.
[He said this to me with Magus in my party, so I assume he says the same thing no matter what.]

...I think the Japanese version all but explicitly tells us that Eclipse Magus did indeed join up with Crono's party.  The fact that he says "we" defeated Lavos -- in a language where you only bother using the plural when you're making a specific point -- and the line about "I don't know whether I joined up with you guys in your world" heavily implies "but I did join up with you in my world."  To me this seems like the biggest oversight in the English adaptation -- the translator/adaptor got all caught up in making Magus sound all kewl and philosophical and deep as they consistently do throughout CTDS, and accidentally obscured this specific fact in the process.

I was actually starting to really like the idea of Eclipse Magus coming from an unknown alternate dimension, so can the backers come up with some kind of theoretical rebuttal?

Well I'll say it again:

1. Dimension A: Chrono and Co. defeat Lavos
2. Dimension A: Magus goes out to find Schala
3. Dimension B: Chrono and Co. stumble upon dimensional distortions instead of fighting Lavos
4. Dimensional Distortions: Dimension B Chrono Team learns of Dalton's plans, defeat some clones and enter  Time's Eclipse
5. Time's Eclipse: Dimension B Chrono Team meets Dimension A Magus, who references the battle with Lavos
6. Time's Eclipse: Dimension B Chrono Team defeat the Dream Devourer but are sent back to their own time. Magus has his memories erased and is sent somewhere.
7. Dimension A: Dalton invades Guardia, Chrono Team A is blindsided because only Team B was informed.
   And life goes on...

    maybe?  not really a rebuttal lol  I'm really happy with the Japanese version.

[Acacia Sgt]

There is a flaw, though. Why would Lavos's defeat in one dimension would make an entrance to the DBT and the Dream Devourer in another?

[Eske]

That depends on the answer to this question (I haven't played CC in years)

What is so special about the gate to the DBT in CC?

If my instincts are right and they usually...aren't - thats where Serge was killed/not killed right?

If thats the case (and I hope it is)  pathways to the DBT appear where something that should not have happened, happened.  Examples in this case are Serge living (blame Schala) and Lavos's defeat (blame Entity).

So I'm guessing (again) that the bucket takes Crono Team B to post 1999AD Lavos battle site for dimension A. The gate further back by Magus II marks Lavos's grave and the CT entrance to the DBT.

So:

1. New gate at EoT is just another dimensional vortex - sending them to dimension A (convenient)
2. Pathways to DBT appear at sites where time was changed by an external force.

maybe 

[Dark Serge]

Eclipse Magus notes that he has already defeated Lavos as well in his dimension, so the entrance to DBT appeared there probably too somehow

[Shadow D. Darkman]

That depends on the answer to this question (I haven't played CC in years)

What is so special about the gate to the DBT in CC?

If my instincts are right and they usually...aren't - thats where Serge was killed/not killed right?

If thats the case (and I hope it is)  pathways to the DBT appear where something that should not have happened, happened.  Examples in this case are Serge living (blame Schala) and Lavos's defeat (blame Entity).

So I'm guessing (again) that the bucket takes Crono Team B to post 1999AD Lavos battle site for dimension A. The gate further back by Magus II marks Lavos's grave and the CT entrance to the DBT.

So:

1. New gate at EoT is just another dimensional vortex - sending them to dimension A (convenient)
2. Pathways to DBT appear at sites where time was changed by an external force.

maybe 

Actually I think the CC DBT gate was made by Serge dying, as the Ideal Timeline has him alive. Why it's in Home World is anyone's guess.

[Eske]

Eclipse Magus notes that he has already defeated Lavos as well in his dimension, so the entrance to DBT appeared there probably too somehow

I was saying that Eclipse Magus is from Dimension A, the player's original run through of the game, where Lavos was defeated.
Hence the entrance to the DBT appeared there, along with distortions in other dimensions apparently.

That depends on the answer to this question (I haven't played CC in years)

What is so special about the gate to the DBT in CC?

If my instincts are right and they usually...aren't - thats where Serge was killed/not killed right?

If thats the case (and I hope it is)  pathways to the DBT appear where something that should not have happened, happened.  Examples in this case are Serge living (blame Schala) and Lavos's defeat (blame Entity).

So I'm guessing (again) that the bucket takes Crono Team B to post 1999AD Lavos battle site for dimension A. The gate further back by Magus II marks Lavos's grave and the CT entrance to the DBT.

So:

1. New gate at EoT is just another dimensional vortex - sending them to dimension A (convenient)
2. Pathways to DBT appear at sites where time was changed by an external force.

maybe 

Actually I think the CC DBT gate was made by Serge dying, as the Ideal Timeline has him alive. Why it's in Home World is anyone's guess.

Didn't Belthasar say the world where Serge is alive is the false world? I seriously read a quote like that on the forums yesterday lol but it doesn't matter:  Serge was supposed to die and Schala stepped in from the DBT to stop it, causing the dimensional split.  The entrance to the DBT is in Home World because that is where Serge is alive (the problem).  In Another World Serge died and everything is normal.