Author Topic: Chrono Trigger DS Analysis HQ (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)  (Read 140759 times)

Dark Serge

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #45 on: November 23, 2008, 02:44:42 pm »
And then what? Either they were sent to 1005 AD and were too late, or they were sent to 1000 AD and DID wait 5 years for Dalton to show up. The point is either way, they weren't strong enough to take Dalton and his army.

jsondag2: And you don't think Lavos would've killed Magus if he remained there alone? How would he have escaped?

art_garfunkel

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #46 on: November 23, 2008, 03:04:46 pm »
And then what? Either they were sent to 1005 AD and were too late, or they were sent to 1000 AD and DID wait 5 years for Dalton to show up. The point is either way, they weren't strong enough to take Dalton and his army.

jsondag2: And you don't think Lavos would've killed Magus if he remained there alone? How would he have escaped?
Its impossible for them to be sent to after the Fall of Guardia. The final FMV (Chrono and Marle's marriage) is still canon.

Dark Serge

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #47 on: November 23, 2008, 03:23:55 pm »
I suppose so. Then it just means they were defeated by Dalton.

Eket

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #48 on: November 23, 2008, 03:35:36 pm »
Dalton, and the Fall

Meh... Dalton should have just said something along the lines: I'll come back to haunt you when you least expect it. This referring to the fall of guardia. He basically blurts out his entire plan in front of them, and that raises more questions than it actually answers(You don't have to attempt to answer them).

Did Crono and Co simply choose to ignore this?
Did schala wipe their memory of the event?
Did schala sent them back when it had already occurred?
How did Dalton even become this powerfull? Face it the guy was a pansy
How did Dalton deal with Crono and Marle? I don't believe in killing major characters offscreen. It doesn't do them justice and is simply the cheapest way out.
What became of Dalton after the fall?

In any case i refuse to believe that Crono and Marle wouldn't do anything about it. The Fall of Guardia probably happened like planned. Dalton steals the masamune and flees to denadoro mountains with at leastCrono in pursuit.    I think the final battle between Crono and Dalton happened there. Dalton is most likely defeated/killed.

I mean Porre invades El Nido at some point. If Dalton were still around he'd be there, or at least some mention of him would be made. There are still vague references about Crono and Marle around to support their lives after the Fall, and there basically are none concerning Dalton.

Prophet Magus

I've also been thinking some more on why Magus appears as the Prophet. He is not the one from your party. The one from your party goes back to 12000BC to search for Schala, but by some weird fluke he appears before the Prophet invades zeal kingdom. He tells the prophet what will transpire.

When Lavos is summoned in the ocean palace. The prophet instead of actually attacking Lavos simply waits. Crono and Co appear(and perhaps Magus). Schala attempts to save them, and succeeds. Whatever happens with Schala at this point(i always assumed she was sucked into the dimensional warp Lavos created, also sucks up the Prophet). The other Magus simply waits on his mountain where the CT team runs into him and rejoins them.

Fast forward to the point where Crono and Co go through the new portal, and meet the prophet. He finally reveals himself to be Magus. The party Magus i believe only gives an ! as a dialogue, there could be a hidden meaning behind that. Like holy shiat, it worked o.o;

My theories are probably not as good as some of the theories i've read here though.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2008, 03:45:06 pm by Eket »

art_garfunkel

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #49 on: November 23, 2008, 03:45:47 pm »
Prophet Magus

I've also been thinking some more on why Magus appears as the Prophet. He is not the one from your party. The one from your party goes back to 12000BC to search for Schala, but by some weird fluke he appears before the Prophet invades zeal kingdom. He tells the prophet what will transpire.

When Lavos is summoned in the ocean palace. The prophet instead of actually attacking Lavos simply waits. Crono and Co appear(and perhaps Magus). Schala attempts to save them, and succeeds. Whatever happens with Schala at this point(i always assumed she was sucked into the dimensional warp Lavos created, also sucks up the Prophet). The other Magus simply waits on his mountain where the CT team runs into him and rejoins them.

Fast forward to the point where Crono and Co go through the new portal, and meet the prophet.

My theories are probably not as good as some of the theories i've read here though.
So Magus in his full cloak automatically equals the prophet?

That's about as supportable as Magus = Guile. Which is to say, requires a ridiculous amount of jumping through logic hoops.

Eket

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #50 on: November 23, 2008, 03:46:57 pm »
Why else would Kato put so much emphasis on the frigging cloak, and make him appear as the prophet? And since when has CT/CC been about logic O.o;

art_garfunkel

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #51 on: November 23, 2008, 03:48:22 pm »
Why else would Kato put so much emphasis on the frigging cloak, and make him appear as the prophet? And since when has CT/CC been about logic O.o;
Maybe it's about making you wonder who this is, instead of just having another Magus running around?

Finding the logic is half the fun of these games.

Acacia Sgt

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #52 on: November 23, 2008, 03:54:13 pm »
I think the ones who fight the DD are past versions of them, who were surprised to find the Temporal Vortexes and the portal to Time's Eclipse and decided to check them out. Those areas open after the defeat of Lavos, so why not a past version of them (who can, unlike the current ones, who defeated Lavos and went their separate ways) traveled to those places?

Dark Serge

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #53 on: November 23, 2008, 03:55:35 pm »
Dalton, and the Fall

Meh... Dalton should have just said something along the lines: I'll come back to haunt you when you least expect it. This referring to the fall of guardia. He basically blurts out his entire plan in front of them, and that raises more questions than it actually answers(You don't have to attempt to answer them).

Did Crono and Co simply choose to ignore this?
Did schala wipe their memory of the event?
Did schala sent them back when it had already occurred?
How did Dalton even become this powerfull? Face it the guy was a pansy
How did Dalton deal with Crono and Marle? I don't believe in killing major characters offscreen. It doesn't do them justice and is simply the cheapest way out.
What became of Dalton after the fall?

In any case i refuse to believe that Crono and Marle wouldn't do anything about it. The Fall of Guardia probably happened like planned. Dalton steals the masamune and flees to denadoro mountains with at leastCrono in pursuit.    I think the final battle between Crono and Dalton happened there. Dalton is most likely defeated/killed.

I mean Porre invades El Nido at some point. If Dalton were still around he'd be there, or at least some mention of him would be made. There are still vague references about Crono and Marle around to support their lives after the Fall, and there basically are none concerning Dalton.

Alright since you're so stubborn I'm gonna go through this and answer you again.

- Who knows. If they ignored it they were taken without preparation. If they didn't they just got owned.
- Who knows
- No, as pointed out earlier it's impossible, since the Wedding FMV is still canon
- "The guy was a pansy"? Alright let's look at Dalton's power. He can
     - Summon at least two Golems at once (and probably more)
     - Summon a Golem Overlord
     - He can drain HP
     - He knows powerful elemental spells similar to Chrono's
     - He probably made use of the Sun Stone and the CC elements
     - He knows engineering (he makes the Epoch fly. Later Lucca implies she was planning to do that too)
     Dalton is not a pansy. He is strong and clever.

- Regardless whether you want to believe it or not, it's true. They either got killed or fled. Face it.
- He probably became the ruler of Porre, sending it out to El Nido with Norris in charge, in order to find the Legendary Frozen Flame so he could finally fulfill his dreams

Dalton died against Chrono? Yeah right. Dalton never dies against Chrono & 2 friends, I bet he could take Chrono. Besides, if he died, who would rule Porre. Dalton dies right after accomplishing victory over Guardia? Nonsense.

The reason he wasn't mentioned in Chrono Cross is because Dalton wasn't confirmed yet.

art_garfunkel

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #54 on: November 23, 2008, 03:55:55 pm »
I think the ones who fight the DD are past versions of them, who were surprised to find the Temporal Vortexes and the portal to Time's Eclipse and decided to check them out. Those areas open after the defeat of Lavos, so why not a past version of them (who can, unlike the current ones, who defeated Lavos and went their separate ways) traveled to those places?
Pardon me if I do say that this makes no sense.

Acacia Sgt

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #55 on: November 23, 2008, 03:57:56 pm »
I think the ones who fight the DD are past versions of them, who were surprised to find the Temporal Vortexes and the portal to Time's Eclipse and decided to check them out. Those areas open after the defeat of Lavos, so why not a past version of them (who can, unlike the current ones, who defeated Lavos and went their separate ways) traveled to those places?
Pardon me if I do say that this makes no sense.

Taken from a previous post of mine:

After all, even if they are in, for example, 600 A.D. fighting Retinite, before, while going for the Masamune, there wasn't any Sunken Desert, but after telling the woman in Zeal not to burn the seed, there now is, meaning all past versions who crossed 600 A.D. for various reasons (Looking for the Masamune, going to Magus's Castle, etc.), are now going to see the place. Eventually, they will get Time Bastarded, but still, they can do something that can make a further change to the time line to the ones already done (thankfully they don't, or else more troubles could arrise to keep track of the continuity).

Eket

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #56 on: November 23, 2008, 04:03:32 pm »
One thing i will say DarkSerge: Dalton defeating Crono in 1 one on 1 combat? I find that highly unlikely.

Anyway, Screw it. I'll just leave the theory stuff to the other people at the compendium. I'll come back in a few months to read the endresult, it's better that way. My mind is too clouded by one thing anyway, the fates of Crono and Marle.
It's all i really care about when it comes to Chrono Trigger now. I can't even enjoy the game anymore, there's nothing left of it but mayhem, despair and destruction.

I'm out of here, have a good one.


art_garfunkel

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #57 on: November 23, 2008, 04:04:05 pm »
I think the ones who fight the DD are past versions of them, who were surprised to find the Temporal Vortexes and the portal to Time's Eclipse and decided to check them out. Those areas open after the defeat of Lavos, so why not a past version of them (who can, unlike the current ones, who defeated Lavos and went their separate ways) traveled to those places?
Pardon me if I do say that this makes no sense.

Taken from a previous post of mine:

After all, even if they are in, for example, 600 A.D. fighting Retinite, before, while going for the Masamune, there wasn't any Sunken Desert, but after telling the woman in Zeal not to burn the seed, there now is, meaning all past versions who crossed 600 A.D. for various reasons (Looking for the Masamune, going to Magus's Castle, etc.), are now going to see the place. Eventually, they will get Time Bastarded, but still, they can do something that can make a further change to the time line to the ones already done (thankfully they don't, or else more troubles could arrise to keep track of the continuity).
I prefer to see it as when a change is made to an era, the characters will only see those changes in subsequent visits. It makes things (thankfully) much less confusing. For example, there is the normal flow of time, and there is the character's timeline.

They travel through 1,000 AD at first, there is no forest. -> They then travel to 600 AD and planet the seed. -> They go back to 1000 AD and the forest is there. -> The history books say that a forest grew there starting in 600 AD.

But that does not mean that they forest was there in their past visits to 1000 AD.

Acacia Sgt

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #58 on: November 23, 2008, 04:11:30 pm »
I think the ones who fight the DD are past versions of them, who were surprised to find the Temporal Vortexes and the portal to Time's Eclipse and decided to check them out. Those areas open after the defeat of Lavos, so why not a past version of them (who can, unlike the current ones, who defeated Lavos and went their separate ways) traveled to those places?
Pardon me if I do say that this makes no sense.

Taken from a previous post of mine:

After all, even if they are in, for example, 600 A.D. fighting Retinite, before, while going for the Masamune, there wasn't any Sunken Desert, but after telling the woman in Zeal not to burn the seed, there now is, meaning all past versions who crossed 600 A.D. for various reasons (Looking for the Masamune, going to Magus's Castle, etc.), are now going to see the place. Eventually, they will get Time Bastarded, but still, they can do something that can make a further change to the time line to the ones already done (thankfully they don't, or else more troubles could arrise to keep track of the continuity).
I prefer to see it as when a change is made to an era, the characters will only see those changes in subsequent visits. It makes things (thankfully) much less confusing. For example, there is the normal flow of time, and there is the character's timeline.

They travel through 1,000 AD at first, there is no forest. -> They then travel to 600 AD and planet the seed. -> They go back to 1000 AD and the forest is there. -> The history books say that a forest grew there starting in 600 AD.

But that does not mean that they forest was there in their past visits to 1000 AD.

It will be, since the first time-line-chronological event was the planting of the seed. After that, the forest will grow. In their first travel through 1,000 A.D., the forest will be there. True, it eliminates the need to plant the seed now, but we have Time Bastard and Time Traveler Immunity to solve this. Then, when the ones who planted the seed return to 1,000 A.D., the forest will be there thanks to their change.

FaustWolf

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Re: Chrono Trigger DS New Ending Analysis (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)
« Reply #59 on: November 23, 2008, 04:13:40 pm »
Quote
I can't even enjoy the game anymore, there's nothing left of it but mayhem, despair and destruction.

I'm out of here, have a good one.

Take heart, dear Eket -- Future Magus informs us that there are as many realities as there are potentialities. Somewhere out there, there's a flourishing Guardia with King Crono and Queen Nadia at the helm, and all sorts of little ones running around the castle. Problem is, mayhem, despair and destruction make for interesting sequels. :D