Author Topic: Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more  (Read 5803 times)

Sasquatch

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« on: September 12, 2004, 05:24:04 pm »
Hey, I'm new, so I apologise if I'm just re-treading old topics that have been resolved already. But nevertheless, I do have questions, and you'll have to bear with me seeing as how I haven't played CC in a while (starting a new run-through soon though) and thus a lot about the game confuses me a bit.

1. In Chrono Trigger, in 600 A.D., when Marle disappears due to Queen Leene not being saved as she's supposed to, where does she go? Why exactly does she disappear anyway - would Leene not have to be killed for that to happen?
Is the general consensus that Marle went to the tessarect (sorry if I spelt that wrong, I only came across the term here) since she was erased?

2. In Chrono Cross, when you meet Miguel and (if I remember correctly) at a few other points in the game, some ghost children appear. Who are they, really? I mean, they do look like Crono, Marle and Lucca, but why would they look so young?
In fact, why is Miguel there in the first place? Why couldn't/didn't he just leave? Sorry if that one is answered in the game, just I always feel pretty bad beating up Miguel seeing as how he's seemingly trapped in the Dead Sea.

3. Are there any other theories on how Janus pops into CC other than the usual Guile one? Could he be anyone else? Or are the hints in Lucca's letters that Janus is there with them just thrown in to further tie the games together?

4. How come Harle and Kid's fortunes are the same?...I never quite got that.

5. During the CC "true" ending, we see a girl walking about. Most people take this to mean she's searching for someone, and some say it's Magus/Janus, some say it's Serge - in another thread here, someone said that people wrongly tied Schala down to her daughter/clone Kid, thus assuming she is searching for Serge is misguided.
But, and this is where it gets a bit confusing because it's been a while since I saw the ending, don't Schala and Kid become one in the same at the end? Doesn't Kid just become part of Schala? So isn't it possible that a part of the Kid Serge knew is still very much active in Schala, hence causing her to search for Serge?

And finally...

6. What is everyone's opinion on whether or not Radical Dreamers is part of the "canon" as such?

Sorry that most of these questions are pretty simple (and most of what you guys have debated is mind-blowing stuff!), but I'd just like some clarity on all of this.

ZeaLitY

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2004, 06:01:17 pm »
1. Check the Chrono Trigger Inquiries Thread. Marle was, in all likelihood, abducted temporarily by the Entity to simply further Crono in his quest.

2. Check the Article, Salt for the Dead Sea.

3. Unfortunately no, and the Guile one is a crackpot theory that originates from Gamefaqs. It is full of holes and contradictions.

4. Harle, Kid, and Schala seem to be genetically identical. The Dragon God, consumed by the Time Devourer, probably used the nearest human DNA to construct the 7th Dragon -- the nearest human being Schala, bound to the Time Devourer.

5. Still awaiting finalization. It'll be resolved when we push to finish the Cross ending article.

6. It's an alternate dimension -- at least, Le Tresor Interdit is. The others are often too difficult to recognize with Chrono Trigger. Magus being an intergalactic space officer, anyone?

Leebot

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2004, 11:51:26 pm »
One, two, three... Nope, no fourth wall. Reeeeally hard to call that canon.

Director: Cut! Okay, the line's fine, but I told you it wouldn't work with this robot! People will recognize it from Lost in Space. Leebot must be taken seriously! Somebody, get Brent Spiner on the phone!

V_Translanka

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2004, 04:21:30 am »
I'll jump on 4 & 5 a bit, as they seem the only ones left for much actual discussion...

Kid doesn't become one with Schala. In the end, we see Kid on a boat (Korcha's boat or at least a nice duplicate). I always thought Schala was looking for Janus if she was looking for anyone at all. Why would she look for Serge? Why would she be looking where she was (obviously not El Nido) if she were looking for Serge? Perhaps she's just looking for her place in the world now...But there's that picture at the end which shows her and someone else, who I always assumed was Magus, because it appears to have long hair...

As for Dreamers...I'm not sure about 'canon', but it's an alternate dimension, as much as Cross is anyways. It's at the very least split at the Fall of Guardia, much like Cross itself...

Symmetry

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2004, 06:30:47 pm »
Welcome, Sasquatch.

The only comment I really have to make is that I don't see why there is any reason to think Schala and Kid reunited, other than the note (Or was it a diary? I forget.) in the ending signed by Schala "Kid" Zeal. Kid is an entirely separate being from Schala, just as a child is a separate being from its mother. The two share a common bond, but there is no reason to think that one day the child will "re-enter" its mother, is there? There certainly aren't any game mechanics that I'm aware of that would even allow for such a possibility...

And I'm reminded once more that I really need to play Radical Dreamers.

YbrikMetaknight

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2004, 03:28:25 am »
Magus is an intergalactic space officer...goddamn, that's a funny scenario.  I should replay RD.  It's been well over a year since I played it.

Somebody get me an Evian!

Radical_Dreamer

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2004, 01:47:36 am »
Damnit! Where did I put my Martian Forest League Concealed Lesser Armaments Bunny?

koolkame

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Huh?
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2004, 01:16:07 pm »
I am so not getting these references. :?

Hadriel

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2004, 05:13:41 pm »
Heh.  I'll jump all over these.

1) The most likely scenario is the following:

Queen Leene went missing in 600 A.D. and the Guardian army was searching for her.  In the original timeline, they found her, but when Marle came back and they found her first, they called off their search, thus triggering Marle's disappearance.  In effect, by saving Leene, Crono was making the same thing happen but shifting the pieces around a bit.

2) Miguel came with Wazuki to heal Serge.  They both ended up getting bound to FATE once the Chronopolis system came back online -- if they got out, people would find out about FATE.  Thus, Wazuki ended up becoming Lynx and Miguel was temporally bound to the Dead Sea as FATE's unwilling guardian.  Serge did him a favor by killing him.

3) The only one I can think of is that Janus is there in spirit, or that he is somehow reincarnated into one of the playable characters.  There's no proof for either one, though, but they don't blatantly contradict anything.  However, if Janus can travel through time in Radical Dreamers, he'll figure out a way in the Ideal timeline.  He's a butt-kicking mage.

4) Harle and Kid are both derivatives of the Time Devourer, but Harle comes from Lavos, whereas Kid comes from Schala.

5) Who knows? Maybe she's looking for both of them.  Nobody can pin it down for certain.

6) Some of the scenarios in Radical Dreamers are just too "out there" to be anything more than a dream.  Remember, if you will, that Serge has to fall asleep to trigger the space alien scenario.  Considering that Serge is a traveling musician and not a professional warrior, it's quite likely that he may have been totally hammered at the time and simply had the most wacked-out dream anyone could think of.

koolkame

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Kid/Schala
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2005, 09:25:55 pm »
Are we sure Kid doesn't merge with Schala? If Kid's in the party at the end she doesn't say anything when the third party member speaks. Even if they're from Another World they say something to Serge, so where's kid? If two timelines merge surely two eighteen year old girls can mind meld. God, the sounds wierd, but you get my point. Seriously, what do you guys think?

saridon

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2005, 03:02:31 am »
with the schala and kid becomng one single entity there is little proof for that i mean the only time its suggested is at the end of the proper ending
where at the end of the book it is signed " Schala "Kid" Zeal " it isent very likly that thet merged into a single entity because when you talk to lucca with Kid in the lead she says she's no clone or anything then lucca says "yes im sure she would have wanted it that way" impliying that schala wanted Kid to be a completly different person from her and to live her own life when reading the book it seems that schala wrote that as more of a joke than being merged with Kid and in the fmv it supposed to be Kid if you wath the ending when Schala is freed Kid says somthing (i cant remeber what exactly) about finding serge no matter when or where he was and one more part about the schala merging with Kid during that ending after Schala's talked about life and so forth she begins to talk like Kid this i have no real solid Proof against but mabey it was Kid talking then and Schala talking before as SEPERATE entitys no a single one

and to do with Janus in CC he was supposed to be in it but was edited out due to the amount of character's and dificulty with wrighting his story if guile was supposed to be reveled as magus mabey due to when you lose the bet but in the final version when they took out magus he wasent supposed to be magus

also does anyone know how to trigger the fmv with serge and he masamune in terrmania  see it in te openning but not in the game


...i should probally play radical dreamers

Sentenal

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2005, 01:34:58 pm »
Wait, talk to Lucca with Kid in the lead?  You never talk to Lucca in CC.

Also, here is a piece of Lucca's letter to Kid: When I think of you, I remember someone I once met a long, long time ago in the distant past... Heh! But she was the complete opposite of the you in this time line... So quiet and gentle... Someday I'll also tell you about her... When you are ready to know of your real name and heritage.  Here, Lucca is implying that Kid is either Schala's clone, or something along those lines.  And why else would the letter from Schala "Kid" Zeal even have include "Kid" in there if Schala and Kid didn't become one?

As for who she is looking for, the letter implies that she will be looking for Serge...

V_Translanka

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #12 on: March 06, 2005, 12:02:44 am »
Because, in essence, Kid's real name is Schala Zeal. Ipso facto, the letter is Kid's.

saridon

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #13 on: March 06, 2005, 05:58:34 am »
OMG have you EVEN played CC "sigh" play until you are at the very end when you can fight the final boss there will be the crono marle and lucca ghosts there put kid in the lead and talk to the lucca ghost thing she will say that schala would want kid to lead her own life which disclames the fact that kid merges with schala and as i said before with the book it sorta suggest that both kid and schala are wrighting it cause in the beginning fmv it implies the way it is written that kid is writeing it while in the ending fmv it more gives the impression that schala is writing it i dont think that schala would just go and merge with kid cause she became free and the credits live footage fmv's disclame the fact that they merge hugely, lucca in the letter when she writes when you are ready to know of your real name and heratige. is because since kid is a clone litteraly they are the same person but acorrding to the ghost lucca schala would live her own life not as her clone though her real name is schala zeal ,schala wanted her to be kid,not schala basically she dident want kid to be a clone but a completlly diferent person more of a sister or daughter schala wouldent merge with kid cause schala wanted kid to lead her own life.

really yoy two go back and talk to the lucca ghost with kid in the lead then re-read my posts here itl make it alot clearer.

and i have played through CC alot of times so i do know what i'm alking about here.

and with the siging schala kid zeal like before it could be a joke or kid wrote the whole book and simply used both her "real name" and her name
or schala and kid both wrote it thus since there names are the same it could be signed alone as schala zeal but since schala wanted kid to be kid it was written schala "kid" zeal

Sentenal

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Some questions about CC Ending, Marle vanishing and more
« Reply #14 on: March 06, 2005, 01:46:13 pm »
saridon, in that whole, big paragraph, you had 2 periods.  therefore, it was really hard to read.  and if I had never played CC, then how would I remmber Lucca's letter?  You need to calm down, and use periods.  and Lucca-ghost =|= Lucca.  You never talked to Lucca in CC.

and if Schala and Kid wrote the letter together, it would have said "Schala Zeal and Kid".  Why would it be a joke it was signed 'Schala "Kid" Zeal'?  Why would Kid just all the sudden decide to use her full name and heritage?  It is IMPLIED that they joined after CC.  And your only evidence is something Lucca-ghost said.  Is Lucca-ghost Schala?  No.  That was Lucca-ghost's opinon.