Author Topic: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines  (Read 7979 times)

kazmaka

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Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« on: June 30, 2006, 01:12:56 pm »
Alas you all could of said this already, but its so hard to find what your looking for with the search engine.. so!
Playing CT, and reading everything on Time Error and Lavos's pocket dimension and whatnot, i got confused!
In the ocean palace disaster, Lavos seems fully matured, at a state like when you defeat it, but did Lavos not come to earth as an infant, or Lavos Spawn, correct me if im wrong there because that will probably put all this to rest.
If Lavos's pocket dimension runs on a timeline parrallel to the planets, then surely there must be a timeline for the planet for every second or millisecond (or something of the like) that Lavos is sucking out the planets enegy's.
For example when lavos first arrives on the Earth surely Zeal will not of noticed the large powers of Lavos and it would not have said large powers, and as such would never bother making the mammon machine and the entire Ocean Palace scenario would of been averted, as would the apocolypse, hell the planet would likely be completely diferent.
When Lavos gets enough power for the Zealians to realise, they start up with the mammon machine and ocean palace scenario, although depending on how much power Lavos actaully has at this stage it may not be able to defeat the Zealians, though this seems incredibly unlikely as it would definetly of stopped the Zealians stealing his power or he would of never got to the stage you see him in playing CT (Heh, just realised i keep swapping between it and he when refering to Lavos, apologies).

And one final sidenote, after Crono and crew defeat Lavos, and Belthesar does all his work in time travel and Chronopolis, etc. Why doesnt he try going back in time to when Lavos was landing, as he presumably was in 'Planet Time' during this, and try stopping Lavos from landing or burrowing, i admit it may be hard.. But surely he could time travel far to the future or something and get the technology required for this. If they did so, would it not completely avert the entire events of CT, CC, and RD.

AuraTwilight

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2006, 05:24:09 pm »
Lavos was an adult when he landed, for one. O.o

Quote
If Lavos's pocket dimension runs on a timeline parrallel to the planets, then surely there must be a timeline for the planet for every second or millisecond (or something of the like) that Lavos is sucking out the planets enegy's.
For example when lavos first arrives on the Earth surely Zeal will not of noticed the large powers of Lavos and it would not have said large powers, and as such would never bother making the mammon machine and the entire Ocean Palace scenario would of been averted, as would the apocolypse, hell the planet would likely be completely diferent.
When Lavos gets enough power for the Zealians to realise, they start up with the mammon machine and ocean palace scenario, although depending on how much power Lavos actaully has at this stage it may not be able to defeat the Zealians, though this seems incredibly unlikely as it would definetly of stopped the Zealians stealing his power or he would of never got to the stage you see him in playing CT (Heh, just realised i keep swapping between it and he when refering to Lavos, apologies).

This is all babble. Can you rephrase it please? >.<

Quote
And one final sidenote, after Crono and crew defeat Lavos, and Belthesar does all his work in time travel and Chronopolis, etc. Why doesnt he try going back in time to when Lavos was landing, as he presumably was in 'Planet Time' during this, and try stopping Lavos from landing or burrowing, i admit it may be hard.. But surely he could time travel far to the future or something and get the technology required for this. If they did so, would it not completely avert the entire events of CT, CC, and RD.

Because of two things. One, Time Error. Even if Lavos was destroyed before he landed on Earth, he would still rise at 1999 AD and at the Ocean Palace Incident. And Two, because of Lavos never lands, then there'd be no human race anymore. Not to mention that you gotta wonder how in the hell you're gonna stop Lavos from landing. A giant baseball mitt?

kazmaka

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2006, 07:12:49 pm »
Lavos was an adult when he landed, for one. O.o

Quote
If Lavos's pocket dimension runs on a timeline parrallel to the planets, then surely there must be a timeline for the planet for every second or millisecond (or something of the like) that Lavos is sucking out the planets enegy's.
For example when lavos first arrives on the Earth surely Zeal will not of noticed the large powers of Lavos and it would not have said large powers, and as such would never bother making the mammon machine and the entire Ocean Palace scenario would of been averted, as would the apocolypse, hell the planet would likely be completely diferent.
When Lavos gets enough power for the Zealians to realise, they start up with the mammon machine and ocean palace scenario, although depending on how much power Lavos actaully has at this stage it may not be able to defeat the Zealians, though this seems incredibly unlikely as it would definetly of stopped the Zealians stealing his power or he would of never got to the stage you see him in playing CT (Heh, just realised i keep swapping between it and he when refering to Lavos, apologies).

This is all babble. Can you rephrase it please? >.<

Hmmm, i guess i can try... What happens on the planet when Lavos is still in his infant stage, when he hasnt absorbed much of the planets power ? We only ever see him mature.
Are there timelines for every time something even slightly diferent would happen due to the planet loosing some enegy?
Think thats the jist of it.


Quote
And one final sidenote, after Crono and crew defeat Lavos, and Belthesar does all his work in time travel and Chronopolis, etc. Why doesnt he try going back in time to when Lavos was landing, as he presumably was in 'Planet Time' during this, and try stopping Lavos from landing or burrowing, i admit it may be hard.. But surely he could time travel far to the future or something and get the technology required for this. If they did so, would it not completely avert the entire events of CT, CC, and RD.

Because of two things. One, Time Error. Even if Lavos was destroyed before he landed on Earth, he would still rise at 1999 AD and at the Ocean Palace Incident. And Two, because of Lavos never lands, then there'd be no human race anymore. Not to mention that you gotta wonder how in the hell you're gonna stop Lavos from landing. A giant baseball mitt?

Giant baseball mitt, actually thats what i had in mine 8). And good point on the Time Error, that was kind of a spur of the moment thing.

AuraTwilight

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2006, 11:37:11 pm »
Quote
Hmmm, i guess i can try... What happens on the planet when Lavos is still in his infant stage, when he hasnt absorbed much of the planets power ? We only ever see him mature.
Are there timelines for every time something even slightly diferent would happen due to the planet loosing some enegy?
Think thats the jist of it.

No, a timeline only comes about when someone travels through time. The planet losing energy has nothing to do with it.

kazmaka

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2006, 05:01:03 am »
So what would happen... Does the timeline just keep getting rewritten ? It wouldnt make sense for there to only ever of been a timeline where Lavos was fully mature...

Chrono'99

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2006, 07:01:47 am »
Only the most "recent" timeline exists. The former versions are discarded in the Darkness Beyond Time.

kazmaka

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2006, 07:20:59 am »
Yeah, figures. Would be interesting to know what happened in those timelines.

Chrono'99

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2006, 08:27:58 am »
What difference do you think there would be compared to the game timeline?

kazmaka

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2006, 09:16:33 am »
Well for starters, as i think ive said, the Zealians should never of stopped using the sun stone during a very early timeline, and thus Lavos would never awaken (this all depends on what age Lavos did fall to the planet and if he had much power back then), Zeal should continue to flourish, using the power of the sun stone, unless they ran out of that. If Lavos did never awaken then the Ice Age at least wouldnt of stopped for a while after that. There would of been no apocalpyse because Lavos would still be abosrbing DNA and Energy. I doubt humanity would even learn of Lavos's existence, or if they did in the far future, what would they of done about it ?
Though in theory the only timeline that would ever get a chance to exist for any time would be the last one where Lavos 'Reigns atop Death Peak' as he has stopped all his actions, and no future changes should happen.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2006, 09:18:13 am by kazmaka »

AuraTwilight

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2006, 01:47:46 pm »
It wouldn't matter anyway. Everything you're describing is in a single timeline that's only replaced when Crono and co. start Time Traveling.

kazmaka

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #10 on: July 01, 2006, 02:56:16 pm »
Yes.. Thats only 1 possible timeline, there could be many other possibilities that i cant really be bothered to go into details of and think about. And thats not what happens before Crono and co. start Time Traveling.. The 'Lavos Timeline' is, what i described is clearly diferent.

AuraTwilight

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #11 on: July 02, 2006, 03:13:00 pm »
But "possibilities" won't matter either. -_- You need to reread a few articles clearly.

Chrono'99

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #12 on: July 02, 2006, 03:27:31 pm »
I think you're the one who's missing the point. It's not a matter of possibilities, those timelines clearly... exist...ed. It's just that the game is set in the latest timeline, the one which corresponds to the pocket dimension's timeline in which Lavos is fully grown up and the Planet triggers Crono's adventure.

kazmaka

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2006, 08:37:07 am »
Thanks Chrono'99, that is my point exactly. Well, one person agree'ing with me is all I came here for, thanks for your time.

AuraTwilight

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Re: Another topic on lots of dimensions/timelines
« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2006, 05:11:04 pm »
Well, all those other timelines led to the Apocalypse anyway, so I don't think we're missing a whole lot.