Enhasa Halls - Chrono Series Analysis > Time, Space, and Dimensions
Marle Paradox and Time Traveler Synchronization
Eske:
Hey everyone! It has been awhile. I've thought about the Marle Paradox recently, so here is my latest effort to tackle it (after failing to do so with my Dreamline and Time X ideas.) It isn't fully fleshed out - just something that hit me earlier today. I'd like to submit it now for review, even though it is in its infancy and I haven't fully checked it for conflicts that arise later in the game if it is applied. Basically, I took the Dreamline viewpoint that values perspective, removed the Entity from it and focused on the characters that we play as in-game. The only issue I know of is that this idea (which hopefully isn't similar to other ideas presented recently, I haven't read up on everything - sorry if it is) is pretty much created with the sole intention of resolving the Marle Paradox, without influencing other events in the game - making it feel kind of forced. Any feedback is appreciated - thanks!
Time Traveler Synchronization
For all time travelers passing through a gate, the receiving era is synced to their experience, creating a tangent worldline that only grants them Time Traveler Immunity and discards Time Traveler Immunity previously granted to all time travelers on the parent worldline. If another time traveler enters the same era AFTER the arrival of the time traveler who created the tangent worldline, TTI is granted to them as well, from the perspective of the tangent catalyst.
In the game, we play from the perspective of Crono being the tangent catalyst because we first view 600AD (the receiving era) from his perspective and there are no breaks during his stay there.
First Time Travel Event: Marle Perspective 1000AD – 600AD:
Marle takes the gate in Leene Square from 1000AD to 600AD. There, she is mistaken for her kidnapped ancestor, Queen Leene, and is taken by the guards to the castle. Soon after, Crono shows up and Marle reveals her true identity to him. (Reasonable speculation follows.) Lucca arrives in 600AD, runs up to the Queen's quarters, discovers that Crono is there with Marle, and confirms her suspicion, as stated in the game, that Marle is really Princess Nadia. Lucca notes that someone was supposed to have saved the real Queen, but that may no longer happen because everyone assumes that Marle is the Queen. Lucca suggests that she and Crono go and search for the real Queen, knowing that Marle would not be able to leave the castle. The two discover the hairpin with Guardia’s royal crest in the cathedral, are ambushed by Mystics, meet with Frog, kill Yakra and save the real Queen and the Chancellor. After being thanked back at the castle, Crono, Lucca and Marle say their goodbyes and return to 1000AD.
Second Time Travel Event: Crono Perspective 1000AD – 600AD:
Crono follows Marle through the gate in Leene Square from 1000AD to 600AD. When he arrives at the castle, Marle reveals that she is truly Princess Nadia. After a brief discussion, she vanishes from existence due to a variant of the Grandfather Paradox that is satisfied by circumstances not made expressly clear in the game. Unsure of what to do, he descends to the hallway adjacent to the throne room and runs into Lucca, who explains that Princess Nadia vanished because her ancestor, Queen Leene, was supposed to have been rescued but never was. She suggests searching for the real Queen and the two head to the cathedral, where they find a hairpin with Guardia’s royal crest. They are ambushed by Mystics and meet Frog, who aids them in killing Yakra and saving the real Queen and the Chancellor. After arriving back at the castle, they discover that Marle has reappeared in the Queen's quarters due to the variant Grandfather Paradox's issues being resolved. After being thanked for their daring rescue, Crono, Lucca and Marle say their goodbyes and return to 1000AD.
Third Time Travel Event: Lucca Perspective 1000AD – 600AD:
Note: Unless one of Crono’s ancestors (perhaps a guard taken prisoner in the cathedral) is threatened, there is no reason to believe that Lucca’s account would differ significantly from Crono’s account above.
Process:
Marle Perspective:
Marle travels 600AD --> new worldline created/Marle granted TTI --> Crono travels 600AD (Marle worldline)/Crono granted TTI --> Lucca travels 600AD (Marle worldline)/Lucca granted TTI
Crono Perspective:
Crono travels 600AD --> new worldline created/Crono granted TTI --> Lucca travels 600AD (Crono worldline)/Lucca granted TTI
Lucca Perspective:
Lucca travels 600AD --> new worldline created/Lucca granted TTI
In-game Experience:
In the game, we view the event dubbed the “Marle Paradox" from Crono’s perspective. If Time Traveler Synchronization (TTS) is observed, Crono, by default, is granted TTI and Lucca is granted TTI upon arrival. Marle is unfortunately part of Crono’s synchronized arrival and her TTI granted by her travel event is discarded. In other words, Marle is subject to causality from Crono’s perspective because she isn't granted immunity from her prior time travel event – she is both a part of 600AD and dependent upon events that occur there. Though there is more than one way this story could have gone, all perspectives can be reasonably seen to lead to the same conclusion: the real Queen is saved and our three heroes from 1000AD return home.
Additional Note:
This is meant to explain why Marle is able to disappear at all - not necessarily what made her disappear and why it happened when it did. Hopefully, with more discussion, we can work that part out and get this game that much closer to having a completely consistent approach to time travel. Thanks for reading!
Manly Man:
I had always thought of this as early evidence of the Entity's existence. She got warped away to a place outside of time (perhaps somewhere around The End of Time without all of the blocks and lights and buckets that Gaspar made, or even the Darkness Beyond Time, which is explained in Chrono Cross) in a gambit by the Entity to inspire her friends to not only search after her, but to further meddle with time, and defeat Lavos. The incident had led to Crono being tried or kidnapping, the subsequent jailbreak, and then managing to happen upon the one particular Gate available that would take them to the future and convince them that they need to fix things.
It is, admittedly, a pretty big gamble, but there have been bigger ones that work just fine.
Eske:
--- Quote from: Manly Man on November 14, 2013, 04:32:04 am ---I had always thought of this as early evidence of the Entity's existence. She got warped away to a place outside of time (perhaps somewhere around The End of Time without all of the blocks and lights and buckets that Gaspar made, or even the Darkness Beyond Time, which is explained in Chrono Cross) in a gambit by the Entity to inspire her friends to not only search after her, but to further meddle with time, and defeat Lavos. The incident had led to Crono being tried or kidnapping, the subsequent jailbreak, and then managing to happen upon the one particular Gate available that would take them to the future and convince them that they need to fix things.
It is, admittedly, a pretty big gamble, but there have been bigger ones that work just fine.
--- End quote ---
I have always favored Entity-centered approaches to the game because they give the Entity a larger role - one that is finally acknowledged when the group finally sits down in the forest and ponders what could be causing all of this. The problem with that approach is that we are basically given a free pass to spout "The Entity did it!" whenever we cannot explain a phenomenon in the game. Marle describes her experience as being "cold, dark and lonely" which certainly meshes well with what we see the Darkness Beyond Time to be in Chrono Cross, but "The Entity did it!" should not be an acceptable answer to the problems we find with the logic of the plot. It is fine to say that the Entity did indeed do these things, but we should focus on why they are able to happen - not on the supposed whims of some supernatural being pressing a big red button. That is why I decided to post this idea. I know that it is a forced approach (TTI, TB and TE are sound ways of explaining events throughout the game while this is more isolated) and that it will take me some time to find another situation where it could apply or explain something in-game, but at least it gives logic a chance to prevail, or at least explain, the Entity's desires.
Thank you for your input, Manly Man! :)
Manly Man:
You're welcome for the input as well.
I think the reason why I can settle down on the idea that it's all the will of the Entity is because I've played D&D so much, where nearly everything can be explained by "A wizard did it," which, more often than not, is actually true.
Unfortunately, the Entity is not a wizard, so digging a bit deeper into such things is, indeed, good practice.
ZeaLitY:
Cool. I'm not currently at liberty to imagine what influences it might have on the other TTI-critical theories (like the Time Crash and whatnot), but it works as a good feeder theory, certainly. I'll get it added to the paradox page.
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