Messages

76

Magic, Elements, and Technology / An Elemental Model for Character Abilities

« on: February 08, 2005, 03:37:03 pm »

I wasn't saying Magus controlled the portal, I'm just saying that Magus could have used his magic while in the portal to direct himself to 12000 BC, otherwise he would have ended up at 65000000 BC too. Since Magus was in the process of summoning Lavos when Crono & Co fight him, the spell most likely went wrong when they beat him. A spell of such magnitude that could summon Lavos across space and time would need a lot of concentration I'd think. It even says during the battle after fighting Magus for a bit, "Magus risks casting a spell!" The portal was a result of the Lavos summoning spell messing up, whether caused by Lavos waking up or otherwise.

77

Magic, Elements, and Technology / An Elemental Model for Character Abilities

« on: February 07, 2005, 07:55:57 pm »

I don't think Lavos's attack on Zeal and killing Magus in the original timeline could be automated self defense like some suggest. If it was, ok, Lavos destroyed Zeal when they intruded on his personal space. But then, when Magus summoned him, that would also be intruding on Lavos's space, so why did Lavos only kill Magus, as opposed to destroying 600 AD? It must have been a conscience decision by Lavos, because if Lavos's attack in 12000 BC was automatic, then he would have done the same exact thing in 600 AD. Therefore, Lavos destroyed Zeal because they were a threat, and, in the original timeline, killed Magus. Because of the interference of Crono & Co. when Magus was summoning Lavos, the summoning spell went awry, randomly sending Crono & Co. to 65 million BC, and, either Magus used his magic to direct himself thru the impromtu portal to 12000 BC, or he just randomly ended up there.

78

Magic, Elements, and Technology / An Elemental Model for Character Abilities

« on: February 06, 2005, 09:14:23 pm »

If magic wasn't a threat to Lavos, then he would have no reason to destroy Zeal. The humans of Zeal worshipped Lavos, and did not want him dead. Lavos must have felt they were a threat and that he needed to destroy the Zealians and take away their magic; if he didn't, then he'd have kept them for their DNA.

I don't think that's necessarilly the case. It's obvious that Lavos is a fairly cranky sleeper. Absorbing from a distance is cool with it, but try and summon  it or get too close...fuggid about it! Lavos'll toss everything he's got & more at ya! Perhaps it has to do with it's wierd hybernation period. Maybe it just goes into automated defense mode when something intrudes on its space.

The only time where Lavos was really summoned was when Magus summoned him in 600 AD. Lavos didn't destroy the world in 600 AD after summoned, so that proves that Lavos does not destroy genetic material without a reason. Waking up cranky has nothing to do with it.

79

Magic, Elements, and Technology / An Elemental Model for Character Abilities

« on: February 04, 2005, 01:36:18 am »

Magic is a threat to Lavos, but he does not perceive it as such. He allows humans to hold magic for a long period of time, its all about attaining perfect evolution for Lavos, to use a planets living resources, find what is best, and give that to itself. If the mystics ever did acquire magic from a source outside of themselves, it was most likely Lavos.

If magic wasn't a threat to Lavos, then he would have no reason to destroy Zeal. The humans of Zeal worshipped Lavos, and did not want him dead. Lavos must have felt they were a threat and that he needed to destroy the Zealians and take away their magic; if he didn't, then he'd have kept them for their DNA.

Good point about Masa and Mune. Should've remembered that myself. They're dream beings representing life. I don't think Zeal used the CC model, though, because Chronopolis, and in turn, Dinopolis, weren't around until 7600 B.C. as opposed to Zeal's fall 4400 years earlier, and in no case do Elements exist before the advent of those two forces.

Yes but I talk about how the Zealians see the elements that made the universe in theyr cosmology.

Another thing is those elementals books used in the puzzles in Kajar: Water, wind ,Fire

About the books, Water and Fire, both in CT; but Wind seems to represent Crono's element (Lightning/Heaven) since he has some wind-ish attacks.  Think about it: there are 4 elements in CT, with books for 3, where Shadow element is a combination of the other 3. I think that further represents that the 4 elements make up the universe, not the 6 CC Elements.

80

Characters, Plot, and Themes / interested about miguel

« on: February 02, 2005, 05:05:08 pm »

If Crono was in CC then his color would've been white. In CT, his innate was Heaven--it was changed to Lightning when the game came to the US.

81

Magic, Elements, and Technology / An Elemental Model for Character Abilities

« on: February 01, 2005, 10:11:34 pm »

"Wizards" is a mistranslation.  

According to Arc Impule's retranslation, Spekkio states that only the Mystics are able to use magic after the fall of Zeal.

A zillion years before you brats were born... There was a kingdom where magic thrived. In that world, everybody could use it.
But that kingdom drowned in its own power...
Since then, people haven't been able to use magic. Well, except for the Mystics, right?
But you guys have it. Your hearts are strong. Magic is the strength of your heart -- your power.
Magic consists of four powers: Heaven, Dark, Fire, and Water.

Ah. Well then, only Mystics and Magus could use magic then.

And about Mystics retaining their magic after the fall of Zeal, the magic they used probably wasn't drawn from the Mammon Machine or Sun Stone, so they used 'real' magic, like Magus's. By 'real', I mean born with the magic power; they didn't need an external source to gain their magic abilities from, how most of the Enlightened Ones did. Lavos either couldn't lock the Mystics' magic, or didn't for some reason, but considering the intellegence level of many of the Mystics, I think Lavos couldn't lock their magic.  If he could, he would have, since magic was a great threat to him.

82

Magic, Elements, and Technology / An Elemental Model for Character Abilities

« on: February 01, 2005, 07:44:14 pm »

You are strong of will...!

   That's why the Old One let you
   through.

   Long before you were born...
   ...there was a kingdom where magic
   flourished.
   Everyone there could use it!

   But in time, people began to abuse
   their powers. It got so bad that no
   one was allowed to use magic except
   wizards.

   But you have it...determination, I
   mean!
   Magic needs power of the heart.
   It needs inner strength.

   Magic is divided into 4 types:
   Lightning, Fire, Water, & Shadow.

 Ok, so at some point, somebody restriced the use of magic to only a certain few. I believe the people after the fall of Zeal decided that magic can only lead to more segregation of individuals, so they abandoned it.

That "somebody" who restricted magic was more likely than not Lavos. And instead of the word 'restricted', I'd say it's more fitting to call it 'locked'. As in, Lavos took away their ability to use magic when he realized how much of a threat it was to him, but he obviously couldn't take it away completely, more like he locked it away, seeing how Spekkio could unlock it. Wizards and Mystics and Magus could still use it because they could use in naturally, as in without the aid of the Mammon Machine or Sun Stone. I don't think that the former Enlightened Ones would have stopped using magic if they still had the ability to, because none of them knew what happened at the Ocean Palace, all they knew was that their world fell apart, literally. Considering that the sudden turn of events most likely madee life harder for everyone, if they could have used their magic to help out, they would have.

On a bit of a side note (sort of), I kept wizards and mystics separate because I don't think that when Frog or anyone else mentions wizards that they mean mystics. We know mystics use magic; as for wizards, we didn't see any wizards besides Magus in CT, but that doesn't mean they didn't exist, since in CC there are several wizards, like Guile (I can't remember any others at the moment).

83

Magic, Elements, and Technology / Spekkio...

« on: January 30, 2005, 02:43:46 pm »

It's stated within the game that the Zealians got their magic from Lavos through the mammon machine, and before that they got magic from the sun stone.  

And after the fall of Zeal, no one who used the mammon machine to get their magic were able to use it anymore.  They weren't forbidden to use magic, they couldn't use magic. One of the former Enlightened Ones says something along the lines of "We Enlightend Ones have lost our magic. No distinction remains between us and the Earthbound Ones anymore." (not sure on the exact wording, but it was something along those lines)

84

Magic, Elements, and Technology / Spekkio...

« on: January 27, 2005, 10:54:35 pm »

Who's to say how big the End of Time is anyway? But, if Spekkio is a god and doesn't possess the ability to travel through time, then after everything else ended he'd be still swimming around in the end of time. Plus, I'd imagine it would be nice to have something tangible to stand on and whatnot, so Spekkio could've found those pillars of light, and created the floor and whatnot at the end of time. I would think being flung into the end of time by a sudden Lavos-portal wouldn't be an exact science, considering they all fell into one portal but ended up at completely different times, so Gaspar could have landed anywhere, and Spekkio found him and brought him to the platform with the time gate pillars.

Perhaps, but that doesnt quite help explain who spekkio is and what he is doing at the end of time. Why would those pillars of light just be sitting right there when he found them? Unless Gaspar has something to do with his creation, I think its reasonable to infer that Spekkio resides at the EoT to observe and enjoy the various battles occurring throughout time. But thats only if Gaspar and Spekkio are completely separate.

Okay. Let's assume for a moment that Spekkio is who he says he is, God of War. Gods in Roman mythology went along with the flow of time just like any normal person, so Spekkio has been around all through the ages and whatnot. Time eventually comes to an end, but since Spekkio is immortal-God-guy, he's left to his own devices at the EoT.

Now for the pillars of light.  They link to many important time periods of that planet's history. I assume that can't be random; they so conveniently linked to every time needed by Crono and Co. to rid the planet of Lavos, so I think it's a good chance that the Entity put them there.  In all possibility, after time ended, the Entity probably put Spekkio there for the same purpose as the pillars. So if Spekkio is the God of War, and the creation of the Entity, then he's like some sort of Son-of-God type deal, except warlike. And it could be said that he holds the keys to salvation from Lavos, since he unlocks the magical ability of Crono and Co., since without it they wouldn't get very far against Lavos.

85

Magic, Elements, and Technology / Spekkio...

« on: January 27, 2005, 04:19:10 pm »

Who's to say how big the End of Time is anyway? But, if Spekkio is a god and doesn't possess the ability to travel through time, then after everything else ended he'd be still swimming around in the end of time. Plus, I'd imagine it would be nice to have something tangible to stand on and whatnot, so Spekkio could've found those pillars of light, and created the floor and whatnot at the end of time. I would think being flung into the end of time by a sudden Lavos-portal wouldn't be an exact science, considering they all fell into one portal but ended up at completely different times, so Gaspar could have landed anywhere, and Spekkio found him and brought him to the platform with the time gate pillars.

86

Magic, Elements, and Technology / An Elemental Model for Character Abilities

« on: January 27, 2005, 03:54:26 pm »

With Lavos crashing into the Earth, maybe it's something that Lavos, under normal Lavos circumstances, wouldn't survive. A bird learns to fly on instinct. So, baby Lavos gets old enough to leave the planet it's born on, crashes into the Earth, and on instinct uses a form of Magus's Magic Wall spell on a large, powerful scale.

As for the CC Elements, I always thought of them similar to FF7's materia. As in, artificially created from places where the planet's energy is close to the surface and can be harnessed, and thereby not the natural elements of the world, like those Spekkio stated, but rather physical effects of the world imbued into whatever the Elements are. By this I mean Magic is the 'elemental energy' or the world, but Elements produce physical energy effects based off of the four elements.

It would be helpful if we had actually seen any Elements in CC, but meh, what can ya do?

87

Polling / 1/29/05 - What "made" the Chrono series for you?

« on: January 27, 2005, 03:03:33 pm »

Since I couldn't choose all of 'em, I went with characters, because even with all the other elements combined, i feel the characters are the glue that holds it all together. I mean, if instead of Frog, the game had Gene Simmons as Frog, well, it would ruin everything else about the game. Even for Chrono Cross, I felt the characters were the most important--at least, the few that were actually developed(Serge, Kid, Fargo, Radius, Lynx...can't think of any more, it's been awhile). While I would have rather had a handful of well-developed characters instead of 40+ not-developed characters, the ones who actually mattered to the story were superb.

88

Polling / 1/22/05 - What's your favorite bonus feature in the series?

« on: January 22, 2005, 12:41:54 am »

I loved the Chrono Trigger cutscenes, 'specially Frog outside of the Magic Cave. Booya.

89

History, Locations, and Artifacts / Rise Of Porre

« on: December 08, 2004, 05:18:19 am »

About the Masamune, and it becoming evil, I have a theory which (I think) no one has come up with.   Ok, up until 600 AD, anyone who wanted to wield the Masamune would have to first beat the test of Masa and Mune, first separately, and then their full power.  Only Cyrus, and then Crono & Co have been able to beat that test, as before you fight Masa & Mune combined, they say that only Cyrus got that far.  We can probably assume that many others had tried for it before, and failed.  Now, after Glenn presumably returns the sword to Denadoro, Masa & Mune sleep 'til awakened in CC, although the sword still contains energy stored from Lavos.  But the sword obviously isn't in Denadoro at the end of CT, so someone would've had to take it out of there, most likely from Guardia.  Ok, now here's where my theory actually comes in:  if Masa & Mune are sleeping, then who's there to give the test? Masa & Mune's test was to determine if the possible wielder is worthy and strong enough to use the Masamune, but since they are asleep, the Lavos energy is left uncontrolled, and instead of the normal test, it is more of a test of the wielder's will versus the remnants of Lavos in the sword.  Win, and wielder controls sword. Lose, and sword controls wielder, preying upon their fears and evils within their body and mind, and Masamune becomes the demonsword.  The sword then stays that way until someone who passes the "test" comes in possession of it, Serge, thereby neutralizing, if not eradicating, the Lavos remnants contained within the sword.