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Messages - cymorg

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1
Chrono Series Tarot Card Project / Re: XIX. Sun - Lucca w/ Sun Stone
« on: September 16, 2020, 11:34:00 pm »




Working on the Lucca card, here's my first thumbnail and a color mockup to show the direction I'm planning on moving in.

Going into my process, I don't really see Lucca as a flowery type, decided not to incorporate the flower imagery since I think the Sun Stone itself is a good equivalent for them: both needing the power of the sun to flourish. The red banner on the original card are two banners from the fair. They were also appropriately red so it worked out. I love light and the idea of having two light sources for this piece was too much for me to resist - so Lucca is posed directly in front of the sun to create the most contrast. Instead of rays I decided to do smoke that obscures the sun a bit, creates more visual movement, and also reinforces the wind direction that's affecting her hair and dress. Also, I wanted to at least allude to her element of fire.

Beyond the banners in the distant background I was going to do an implication of distant scenery, maybe the fair, but that's something to worry about later. Right now I'm just blocking the major elements of the card and seeing how they work.

Also, while I was working on this, I noticed she's holding the stone right around her belly, gives the insinuation of some maternal symbolism. It was completely accidental, but considering her role in Cross, it kinda grew on me.

Feedback is appreciated!

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Chrono Series Tarot Card Project / Re: Chrono Tarot: The Official Guide
« on: September 15, 2020, 07:46:36 pm »
Heard about this project and it immediately had my attention, I looove tarot decks and the idea of one for Chrono sounds fantastic, so I spent some time reviewing the threads and submission guidelines for the tarots. Haven't seen anyone attempt to make a thread for Lucca/The Sun, started gathering references and looking at examples of the other finished cards. I feel kind of awkward just jumping in and making a thread so I at least wanted to express my interest here. I have a thread showcasing my art in the Fan Art forum if anyone wants to review my work.

I saw that Frog/Justice has a thread here, but I didn't see any finished card for him so I assume that's still on the table as well?

3
Fan Art / Re: Scha-La! Head Schala!
« on: September 05, 2020, 11:35:40 pm »
Lovely stuff!! I adore that tarot illustration. Great idea to work from a 3D reference, I find it really helpful myself with architectural backgrounds.

Is the tarot project you did this for closed to other artist participation, just out of curiosity? I would love to contribute if not!

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Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: August 30, 2020, 05:29:30 pm »
Really enjoying these!  We should talk about a collab at some point. :)

Thank you so much!! You did Cross Symphonic, right? I'm more than happy to return the follow, I absolutely adore the music of Cross. I'd love to do a collab! Did you have any particular ideas in mind?

(But I just have to add, if anything involving Lucca/Frog's theme was on the table, I'd draw whatever you wanted, LOL)

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Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: August 28, 2020, 02:32:18 pm »
Dayum, son! Those are some good artworks. I'mma follow you on the Twit.


Thank you!! I'm happy to have the support! (Fair warning, I do make plenty of silly posts on there, but it is also where I post all my art first and foremost!)

6
Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: August 27, 2020, 08:02:53 am »
WHOA!

Did you have any social networks? If you have Twitter i would totally RT those arts on my fanclub!

I do! I'm on twitter as https://twitter.com/cym0rg/, and you can probably find most of these images in my media tab (as well as plenty of others I haven't posted here.) I'm also on tumblr under the same username, though I'm not as active there. I would love some promotion to fellow Chrono fans, thank you so much if you decide to retweet my stuff! <3

Dalton coming back and instituting some kind of his own faux-Zeal command structure, hidden from the normal Porre government, is an incredible idea. Right down to the Zeal fashion. Man, the cat would be out of the bag, then. Waaay too tantalizing.

Right? In the story, Dalton is given some major character exploration as to why he is the way he is, especially as the emperor-king of Porre, and a big part of his character is his obsession with Zeal and his anger at it being ripped away from him - since he always wanted to rule his idea of a perfect society, and he's constantly resentful of the world for taking what he believes should have been his. He wants to try and recapture parts of Zeal where he can with his new empire, hence forcing Lucca into a role that was specific only to Zeal, and that is otherwise completely foreign to Porre. Aside from keeping her from time traveling to jeopardize his current reign, he covets her because he wants her to build him a new Blackbird, so he can fly across the seas and conquer the rest of the known world. (Dalton is also the one who attacks her home and kills her children, but he does so with the goal of capturing Lucca, not killing her, because he recognizes that her intellect is matched only by the gurus of his time and it would be a waste to kill her before she could be properly extorted.) Still, Zeal is gone forever and no amount of dressing Lucca up or making her rebuild the ship will change that, and Dalton is still a sad sack. LOL

Another note is that Glenn 2.0 is Glenn's son, one of the children in the orphanage, and is raised as Kid's brother which is why he appears in the earlier image with Lucca and young Kid. His character got a massive overhaul so that he's more of a foil to Glenn rather than an echo of him.


7
Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: August 26, 2020, 02:19:13 pm »

Well, since I'm here, I see it's been a while since I posted any art, so I should fix that. I've been doing a lot of freelance work lately so most of my artistic energy has gone towards that rather than Chrono, but I still try my best to find time for it where I can. This posts' offerings might be a little sketchy compared to my other, more refined pieces.





Started sketching in a new style, did a Marle. And also an Ayla on a dinosaur mount, because I think that riding them would be really cool in a remake or something. (See, I can draw characters other than Lucca+Glenn! :wink:)



Just kidding, we're back to Lucca. This one's for a Cross Rewrite/AU where Dalton makes her his guru, seeing as she's the only person with approximate knowledge to them in the modern era. You can probably guess how much she enjoys that.



A sketch with some color. No idea if horses exist in the Chrono canon but if they did, I imagine Lucca could probably not ride them. Glenn is great with them though.



Sometimes when I don't have time to properly sketch an illustration idea I just go into ms paint and doodle it. Not my best but people seemed to like it more than I expected, so why not. Here's Glenn doing as frogs do.



Most recent sketch of an older Lucca and Glenn. Perhaps my deepest and most self-indulgent desire is for them to have gotten married and raised all 10 of those kids from Cross. Assume all of my art takes place in a universe where that happened. My second most deeply self-indulgent desire is that Glenn grows a beard later in life.


8
Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: August 26, 2020, 01:48:03 pm »
Yeah, these are great. Getting these on. This site update is taking days to get through, ugh. But I'm glad there's so much great new stuff to add, like this. Makes me pine for the Glenn hack idea.

Thank you!! Also, Glenn hack idea? I'm really curious about that, especially since I've always wanted some kind of spin-off story that revolves around him - bonus points if that side-story lets you play as human Glenn. Always been a pipe dream of mine!

I thought Lucca was holding young Glenn's hand in that first image and my heart almost broke of cuteness. :o

I really love the scenery in these, especially the last with Lucca and Glenn by a pond. They're almost picture book-esque. The lightning is really great.

She really should've been, but I wasn't thinking about it at the time. Ah well, I'll just have to make it happen in some other piece. Still, your kind words about it mean a lot to me! Thank you so much for being so consistently supportive, Kodokami!!

9
Kajar Laboratories / Re: Heightmaps
« on: June 12, 2020, 11:15:43 pm »
Hi Schala! I'm not really experienced with heightmaps and the like, I mostly have experience with character stuff in the 3D realm. But I just wanted to say that your assets are looking really nice! The shaders look excellent. What program are you making these in, and have you heard of substance painter?

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Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: June 12, 2020, 11:11:12 pm »
Hiii! Back with more art. Trying to push myself to do more finished pieces.



Really love the idea of Lucca raising Kid. In my Cross rewrite, Glenn 2.0 is also there. For reasons.




more self-indulgent romance shit, did a process gif if anyone is interested in seeing that



and here's one I'm working on now, I tend to bounce around between projects and I'm usually juggling 2-3 at any given moment.



Another wip, more romantic shit but this time Frog is... a frog! Actually this is my favorite drawing of Frog I've done to date, he's kind of challenging to draw but I feel like I finally got him here.



Been busy with school so I haven't had a ton of time for personal projects but I hope you guys enjoy these! They were a lot of fun to make and I want to continue pushing myself, and Chrono is a great source of inspiration.

I just want to echo that is some excellent art.

And the z-brush bust is impressive too, I never would have guessed you're new to 3d modeling.

Thank you so much! I want to keep getting better at both 3d and 2d art, and the Chrono characters are excellent test subjects.


Agreed... wouldn't mind seeing more of either.

Seems like you're in luck, then!

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Characters, Plot, and Themes / Glenn's Age Speculation
« on: May 20, 2020, 09:08:16 pm »
Hi everyone! A while back I started an art thread which prompted a discussion about Glenn's age and why I don't really believe that it's 40, purely based on evidence presented in the game. I'd prefer if my art thread remained focused on the art and didn't get clogged up with this debate, so I'm just going to start a separate thread purely meant to discuss this theory.

For starters, I'm going to be taking all of my information from the Chrono Trigger Steam edition, since it is the most recent official release of the game and reflects the most updated canon, if you will. Chrono Trigger itself will be my first party source, with all supplemental information being lower priority sources. I won't be operating off of the information provided in any supplemental material, I am solely looking at the information presented in the game, and then I'll compare the two at the end.


I: Establishing a Timeline

First things first, we need to pinpoint when major events occurred. Our main point of reference is that in 600 AD, when reflecting on the Masamune, Glenn states that he has been cursed for a decade. The information we can glean from this is that he was cursed in 590 AD. Exactly how old he was when this event occurred is up for debate, especially since his childhood flashback neglects to state a year. However, since Glenn mentions that his curse was placed on him in 590 AD, it can be presumed that the confrontation between Cyrus and Magus happened during this year. Considering that Cyrus and Glenn retain the same sprites as the year of the confrontation implies that the events with the Frog King also occur close by this time as well.

The next most important date we have to consider is Janus' appearance in the Middle Ages. This matters because it means that Glenn cannot possibly be older than Janus, as Janus rising to power as Magus is what prompts the events of 590 AD, and possibly reaches back further. I'll also get into sprite evidence that supports the idea that Magus is physically older than Glenn during their first confrontation later. But it's not unreasonable to consider that Magus was bolstering the might of the Mystics, turning the tides or perhaps even starting the war, which then leads to Cyrus announcing his intention to join the knights. Glenn mentions his fear about being "in a real battle", establishing that Guardia was most likely at war during the time of this conversation.

So, the timeline's looking like this:

5xx: Janus appears and is taken in by Ozzie.
5xx: Glenn, as a child, is bullied and rescued by Cyrus, who appears to be a teenager.
5xx: Glenn, now presumably a teenager, is approached by Cyrus and asked to join the army. Janus, now calling himself Magus, has risen to power and is the major figurehead in the Mystic war, potentially prompting Cyrus' decision.
~590: Glenn, still presumably a teenager, enlists and becomes Cyrus' squire. Cyrus defeats the Frog King and obtains the Hero's Medal and the Masamune, emboldening him to confront Magus and end the war.
590: Cyrus confronts Magus, resulting in his death. Glenn is cursed.
600: Now having been cursed for a decade, Glenn meets the rest of the party and the events of the game occur.



II: A Sprite's Worth a Thousand Words

A lot of this theory boils down to the presentation that the game gives to Glenn. Concrete ages in Chrono Trigger proper are nearly nonexistent, mostly chalking up the characters to assumed age ranges of young adult, adult, elder, child, etc. But Glenn is interesting in that he probably has the most range in his sprites - we see him as a child, a teenager, and finally an adult.

To start, let's look at the most clear demonstration of age progression via sprites in Chrono Trigger - when Lucca is explaining the lineage of Princess Nadia. In the scene, each queen begins as a child, shifts into a transitional young adult/teenager sprite, and then finally into the familiar queen sprite which represents her adulthood, as that's when she produces the next queen. That's 3 sprites, one for childhood, young adult, and adult proper. This perfectly matches the sprites that we have for Glenn, pictured here.


Child, teen, adult. Now, I'm going to cross-reference the sprites of the other major npcs that appear in Glenn's flashbacks and in the era. I went ahead and made a little chart to demonstrate the characters and what sprites they were using along with the known dates.


Maybe with this visual comparison it's a little easier to understand why I think Glenn was very clearly intended to be younger than both Cyrus and Magus at the time of the confrontation. He even appears to be younger than Leene, as she appears to be an adult as well. Glenn, however, seems to very firmly be in that transitional stage from child to proper adult. Considering that Magus' sprite doesn't change in the 10 years between the curse and the events of the game, I'm also quite certain that is a full adult. You could chalk this up to magic, perhaps, but Leene and the King's sprites also stay the same through this period - and they're ordinary but still important NPCs who never have access to potentially anti-aging magic.

I would even go so far as to say that Glenn was even a knight at the time of his curse. He was pretty clearly intended to be a squire to Cyrus, the established knight and hero. We see the uniforms of the fellow knights clamoring around Cyrus as he prepares to leave, and Glenn is not among them. He doesn't wear armor, a curious choice, but instead simple clothes, suggesting that he was not actually involved in the fighting and was instead mostly there to study Cyrus. The choice feels pretty deliberate, considering that a generic knight sprite would have all the same poses needed for his flashback. The way he hangs back during the fight with the Frog King would seem to suggest this as well. 

Squires were typically enlisted at 14-15, and while it's important to remember that Chrono Trigger is not at all based in reality, the clear inspiration from real-world history is perhaps most prevalent in the Middle Ages. This is tangential evidence, but it supports the conclusion that Glenn was a teenager - as evidenced by his sprites and his occupation at the time by drawing on a real-world parallel.

Another thing I would like to point out that it was seemingly a very deliberate choice to show Glenn as weak, young, and inexperienced when he was cursed. The fact that he has so many sprites for his various stages of life, when it would have been simple to reuse his post-curse human form, seems to be in favor of the idea that Glenn was still young at the time and has done significant aging since he was cursed, as now his sprite is completely different.

You could argue that this new sprite could be to represent his transformation into a hero. However, that would mean that his 590 sprite was an adult, when it has clearly been pretty consistently used to represent teenage/young adult characters, and means that Cyrus must be significantly older than Glenn if he was a full adult when Glenn was a child. It's... kinda weird for them to be friends if that's the case? So I doubt that was the intention. And this postulation is patchy at best because it doesn't account for the fact that Cyrus does change as he ages, and seemingly so does Glenn.



III: The "Canon" Ages

There was allegedly a magazine which published "canon" ages to the characters. This fact is so obscure that I've gone a decade without ever picking up on it, and when I first heard about it, I thought it was fabricated simply because of the inconsistencies it creates with Glenn as he's shown in the game.

If we assume that Glenn is 40 in 600 AD, this presents a pretty significant discrepancy with the Glenn we're shown in his flashbacks. If Glenn was 40 in 600 AD, it would mean that he was 30 when he was cursed. A 30 year old squire, not even actively participating in the fight and instead clinging to an older and more experienced mentor? That doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me. At the very least, it makes Glenn look like an incredibly inept squire to still be following Cyrus around and still heavily depending on him at 30. The average person at 30 is well past the age to significantly grow, so it also seems odd that Glenn would still be shown with another sprite and not simply shown as his final, post-game form if this was the intent.

However, assuming that Glenn was between 14-20 during his time as Cyrus' squire perfectly contextualizes his actions, his role in relation to him, and matches with the progression of age in the sprites. This would place his age in 600 near the age range that Cyrus was in 590, since Glenn always seems to be one major "sprite stage" behind Cyrus in terms of their age gap.

Another note I find interesting is the fact that Lucca, a young and seemingly fastidious girl, expresses very candid attraction to him. This seems to support that he's in his "prime" as well, and not nearing middle aged. She makes no such comment about Magus, who would likely be much closer to the 40's age range. (Though it's also possible he's just not her type so she wouldn't have commented anyway.) In fact, she doesn't speak about anyone in the game the way she talks about Glenn. Of course, men in their 40's are the subject of crushes from young women all the time - many male actors continue to be seen as attractive well past their prime. On it's own, I wouldn't really consider this of importance, but in conjunction with everything else I think it's worth considering.



IV: The TL;DR

Glenn being 40 is really strange to me considering a lot of his sprite presentation and what we know about him in the game. I feel like he was probably MUCH younger than 30 when he was cursed, if not half that. At most I would be willing to believe that he's 30 currently - and perhaps 25 at least. And I'm just more inclined to believe the content of the actual game over a third party source full of equally unverifiable information like weight and height that ultimately makes no difference in the game.

So, that's that! If we want to debate it, let's do it here. I ask that we be respectful and considerate of one another's opinions, and acknowledge that the vague nature of the actual ages in the game leaves room for speculation. Whether you believe in the idea that he's 40 or that he's younger, I respect that you feel that way. I simply hope to shed some light on my own opinions and thoughts about the topic, and that extends to the way I portray it in my art.

Whew, if you got through all that then you're a real trooper! Thanks for reading!  :lol:


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Crimson Echoes / Re: Still Love this Game!!
« on: May 18, 2020, 11:24:44 pm »
I just wanted to say how much I still love this game. I got a new phone back in January when I started my new job and I’ve been playing it a lot during the pandemic. I’m on my second play through and I still love this game so much and I just wanted to share. :)

I've been replaying vanilla CT during this quarantine. It's been a good chance to experience it again, it really gets my creative juices going and inspires me to make more art/fic. It got me into drawing and stuff when I was a kid so I guess it's only natural that I'd come back to it all these years. Still the best game of all time, IMO.

I've always wanted to try some of these hacks, though. I could never figure out how to get them to work then, and I guess some things never change, because I still haven't quite figured it out. Glad there's always Youtube, anyway!

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Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: April 29, 2020, 04:54:57 am »
That's info from a V-Jump magazine or so.

―公式初期設定(Vジャンプ掲載)―
  クロノ:17歳 168cm 57kg
  マール:16歳 158cm 45kg
  ルッカ:19歳 160cm 48kg
  カエル:40歳くらい(グレン時の年齢は不明)134cm 42kg
  ロボ:175cm 189kg
  エイラ:24歳 168cm 59kg
  魔王:年齢不明 178cm 58kg

Lucca is 19, while Frog is... 40, apparently.

Quote
Maybe my memory of seeing them on the Compendium was incorrect.
We have several of them scanned, long before that Twitter thread. Unfortunately, the Compendium didn't have the ones for Lucca or Marle either.
https://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Chrono_Trigger_OAV_Manga.html

As politely as possible, the information is interesting but I don't really consider it meaningful to the overall story of the game. It seems to be incredibly obscure information that is only ever mentioned in this one source, and never corroborated anywhere else, much less in the text of the game itself or by the creative team that worked on it. So I don't plan on allowing it to affect my interpretations or my art. I'd prefer if we could drop this debate entirely because I'm not really interested in comparing evidence from the game itself against a third party source. I just want to share my art and my ideas! Hope you understand!

In any case, if you do consider this information canon, (which I don't, personally), then just view my art like an alternate universe where he's younger. :wink:

This art. I like it. ANOTHER!

Memes aside, totally keep this up please. You have skills, and it's becoming my favorite pairing...

Thank you! It's good, an old favorite of mine. If you like it then you'll be happy to know that I don't plan on stopping anytime soon!

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Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: April 26, 2020, 04:18:00 pm »
I am totally digging the art. The 3D stuff is pretty impressive. And Lucca should give Frog more hugs! It's cute because it shows how far their friendship has come. The last one looks like something out of an old Disney movie.

To be honest, I shipped Glenn/Lucca like burning back in the day. I still don't know their official ages but figured they were something of a May-December romance. And I shipped them anyway. :lol:

Thank you!! I'm trying to get better with 3d.... One day maybe even make a full character? I'm a 3d artist by trade, so I know the pipeline. It's a goal to work towards!

Also, I'm pretty sure nobody has any confirmed ages in CT, but when I draw/depict them I'm doing it with the idea that Lucca is in her early 20s and Glenn in his mid 20s. He was only a squire when he was turned, after all, and I believe the average age for a squire was 15? The main thing that clues me into this is the fact that he uses a different sprite for before and after he turns, implying to me that he still had some growing left to do before the frog business. Magus and Cyrus seemed to be fully grown adults and Glenn still a teenager, at least from my perspective - otherwise why not show his post-transformation sprite in the flashback?

It's a good ship though, a classic imo! I like that she realizes she was wrong about him and wants to a good friend to him during the masamune thing. Why else would the game introduce enemies that you need her to defeat at Denadoro and then give her the highest priority to fix the sword? There's an interesting idea there..

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Fan Art / Re: Recent original CT art
« on: April 26, 2020, 06:07:54 am »
Hi people! Sorry for not checking the forum terribly often, I usually post on my twitter like I mentioned in the OP. When it comes to periodically posting art, I'm not sure if I should edit the OP or if a bump with the new stuff will suffice - but I'm gonna try the latter for now. Anyway, I got new stuff.



Started learning Zbrush for school stuff, decided to practice my new skills with a bust of Lucca. Forgive that she doesn't have glasses, I haven't learned a way to make them (that looks good). It's always been a dream of mine to translate the Chrono characters into 3d, so I'm happy I'm able to take steps towards that.



Glenn is just... so good. I adore his original human design, I think it fits him perfectly. He's my boy and I wanted to draw him. This style was really fun, was thinking about trying to use it for a graphic novel or something.



Froggy Glenn is cute and I want Lucca to give him a hug. That's all the explanation I have for this one.



Lucca's design in Another Eden is so cute. I like to imagine that's how she looked in Cross, a more mature version of herself running around trying to take care of her 10 kids.



I like Toriyama's style and all, but I feel like it can be a bit limiting for character design. I was kinda playing with the way I would imagine each of them in my own style. Ayla obviously is a lot bigger and more bombastic, I like the idea of Marle having cute dimples, and Lucca having very soft and rounded features.



I'm sure it was obvious before but just in case you weren't sure, yeah I ship em, it was my first ever OTP and they're very near and dear to me. I'm a sucker for a good old fashion forbidden romance. In general their dynamic in the game feels very natural to me. Also it helps that Lucca is crazy for him when she sees him as a human.

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