Chrono Compendium

Guru Workshop - Project Forums - Need One? Ask In Kajar Labs => Chrono Series Tarot Card Project => Topic started by: tushantin on December 13, 2011, 05:30:25 pm

Title: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on December 13, 2011, 05:30:25 pm
VIII.
STRENGTH:
Ayla (http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Ayla.html)

(http://www.learntarot.com/bigjpgs/maj08.jpg)

Summary: *Reserved*

Symbolism: "The key characters are that of a woman and a lion, with the woman looking calm and gentle, yet dominant over the lion. Many cards, including that of the Rider-Waite-Smith deck, have the woman clasping the lion's jaws. Another feature of the RWS deck is a lemniscate (a kind of geometric form) hovering over the woman's head. Other decks have the woman sitting upon the lion, or merely with one hand upon it. Some decks feature just one of the characters; flowers are often presented on this card."
(From wikipedia)

Keywords: Strength, courage, conviction, energy, determination, action, heroism, virility
Reversed: Weakness, pettiness, sickness, tyranny, lack of faith, abuse of power
(From learntarot.com  & themysticeye.com)

Description: "There are many stories that come to mind with this card: Daniel in the lion's den. The Aesop's fable of "The Sun and the Wind," where the Sun's warmth, as compared to the Wind's coldness, persuades a man to take off his coat. Also tales of saintly maids who get brutish barbarians to kneel down in prayer. What we see in all these stories is the taming of the beast by way of inner strength and gentleness.

The Maiden represents higher feelings and that we can experience if we bring our wild passions to heel. And so we willingly do so.

This card, however, isn't just about the Maiden's power. Like its ruling sign Leo, this card is also about the hot, roaring energy and enthusiasm of the Lion including passions like "lust" (which is the name it was given by Crowley in his Thoth deck). The lion's power may be frightening, but it is also desirable. Much can be achieved if such power is put to use. Some decks, in fact, label this card as "Power."

That energies can be brought under control and used is very close to the message of the Chariot, which might be why, in some decks, it is Justice that is card #8 instead of Strength. There is a difference, however, between Strength and the Chariot. The Chariot is a card about using your impulses to achieve a victory.

Strength is about combining two strengths to overcome weakness. The Maiden is weak of form, but her mastery of herself is powerful. The Lion is strong of form, but weak when it comes to mastering himself. The Maiden's commands overcome the Lion's weakness, and his form overcomes the Maiden's weakness. This is why the Maiden doesn't try to harness the lion to a chariot, nor does she run from it or try to kill it. She meets its eyes, touches it, embraces it. This is a card about understanding our wild natures, accepting them, yet also gentling those passions so that they work for us rather than against us. Putting these two strengths together creates perseverance, personal honor, and courage.

The card can also stand for a steadfast friend."

(From Aeclectic Tarot)

Fool's Journey: "The Fool, victorious over his enemies, is feeling arrogant, powerful, even vengeful. There are hot passions in him, ones he finds himself unable and unwilling to control. It is in this state that he comes across a maiden struggling with a lion. Running to help, he arrives in time to see her gently but firmly shut the lion's mouth! In fact, the beast, which seemed so wild and fierce, is now completely at her command.

Amazed, the Fool asks her, "How did you do that?" One hand on the lion's mane, she answers, "I asked the lion to do it, and it did it."

"But-but-" the Fool stutters, confounded. "Why did it want to obey?" At that moment, the Maiden meets the Fool's eyes; he sees in her warmth, gentleness, a heart so great that its generosity seems as infinite as its willingness to understand. And that is when the Fool understands exactly why the lion did her bidding.

It wanted to connect to that higher energy.

Yet there is still one thing that confuses the Fool. "But," he says, much softer now, "Why would you, fair maiden, want to keep company with a beast?"

"Because he, too, is filled with a wonderful energy," the Maiden says. "It is wild and fierce, but it can be banked, like a fire in a hearth. I knew if he would take direction from me, we could both be warmed."

"So, too," she adds, "are our passions. Let them run wild and they will do damage. But we can, with gentle fortitude, check and direct those passions. In doing so, we can get so much more out of them. And yet, still sate them."

His rage quieted, the enlightened Fool walks away knowing that it wasn't only the lion that was tamed this day by a Maiden's pure and innocent strength. '"

(from Aeclectic Tarot)

Feel free to post additional insights into the card, questions, & ideas for the artists to consider!
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on December 13, 2011, 05:31:30 pm
Useful symbolical suggestions:

What if she was riding a sabre-tooth and physically holding a massive tangible infinity symbol above her head, maybe made of stone or something heavy, and it just dwarfs her but she's carrying it like it "ain't no thing"?

as I mentioned, this could feature Ayla closing a sabertooth tigers mouth. It would take the place of the lion well, and it's one of the most recognizable prehistoric species. the background should be easy enough - maybe a volcano in place of the distant mountain.

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Ayla.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smilodon
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on December 14, 2011, 04:27:05 am
as I mentioned, this could feature Ayla closing a sabertooth tigers mouth. It would take the place of the lion well, and it's one of the most recognizable prehistoric species. the background should be easy enough - maybe a volcano in place of the distant mountain.

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Ayla.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smilodon
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: Syna on December 14, 2011, 01:43:51 pm
I think xcalibur's idea works quite well. The lemniscate may be a nice touch, depending on how realistic you want the card to be.
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on December 14, 2011, 01:46:19 pm
I don't think I follow you. What do you mean be "lemniscate"?
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: Syna on December 14, 2011, 02:21:58 pm
Oh, it's just a fancy word for the infinity symbol (the one above the woman's head).
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on December 14, 2011, 02:25:50 pm
I know.  :P I meant, why / how do you intend to have it? As in, clever placement?
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: Syna on December 14, 2011, 03:52:37 pm
I'd say that, if you think it works, put the lemniscate just above her head, the way it's depicted in the Rider-Waite. It may look weird, though.
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on December 14, 2011, 11:21:47 pm
It would indeed look weird. o_O
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: Mr Bekkler on December 15, 2011, 04:30:46 am
What if she was riding a sabre-tooth and physically holding a massive tangible infinity symbol above her head, maybe made of stone or something heavy, and it just dwarfs her but she's carrying it like it "ain't no thing"?
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: Syna on December 15, 2011, 02:28:33 pm
Dude, Bekkler, that would kick ass. And be very Ayla-esque!
Title: Re: VIII. The Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on December 15, 2011, 02:32:19 pm
Thanks, Bekk. Updated the second post. =P
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 18, 2018, 05:42:19 pm
Preliminary sketch. Too exhausted to continue, but wanted to get this layout out of my head. Feel free to critique on the gesture and element-placing if you like. (Yes, xcalibur, you too. XD)

(https://i.imgur.com/GhJR5Mn.png)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: PrincessNadia78 on April 19, 2018, 07:22:30 pm
I live it, I think it looks like a great start. I can'y wait to see this as it progresses!!
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 21, 2018, 09:19:47 am
Any suggestions?

(https://i.imgur.com/ab35Plc.png) (https://i.imgur.com/ab35Plc.png)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on April 21, 2018, 06:34:59 pm
looks good so far. my only complaint is that the jaws should be less open. for the Strength card, you want to clearly portray that the woman is closing the beasts mouth and has power over it.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 21, 2018, 07:33:28 pm
Hmm, noticed your comment a little late, so until then I moved the tiger's head a little closer to Ayla and changed the limbs, suggesting Ayla has some more power over it. But I get what you mean about the jaw, so I'll try to change that tomorrow. Shall I close the tiger's eyes?

Till then, I also added Azala's fortress (which won't be too detailed, and instead silhouetted, since the card is small anyway).

But I don't know what else or how I could potentially add here. How do I add the lemniscate in a sensible way? How or where do I add flowers? What else could I add in here and make it a bit more beautiful, but without stealing attention from Ayla and the tiger? Pterodactyls?

I wanna try finishing this card tomorrow and start with another. xD

(https://i.imgur.com/6XDP6Bb.jpg)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on April 21, 2018, 10:36:33 pm
no need to close the eyes. as I said awhile ago (in 2011!), you could put a volcano in the background. the Reptite Lair is surrounded by volcanoes so that could work.

as for the lemniscate? idk. maybe a simple line drawing? or maybe as a golden hairpiece, although that might not be very Ayla-ish.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 22, 2018, 03:10:57 pm
as I said awhile ago (in 2011!)
....Terrible sorry, man... xD I wasn't very confident as an artist back then and was pretty stupid taking up huge projects I didn't know I could even complete, lol. But I'm 7 years older now, pretty confident, and I'm gonna have a lot of fun this time around. Really, deeply regret keeping you waiting for so long though. I know how much this meant to you.

BTW, I'm done! Couldn't figure out what to do with the Lemniscate, so I just threw it in there. Also added Lavos. That said, I could add more detail to this. Question is, should I? All depends on the style we could go for. The obsessive part of me screams Moar Detail, but the lazy part of me says Leave It Be!

(https://i.imgur.com/gK7H5SA.png)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on April 22, 2018, 05:19:45 pm
it's fine, life happens. it's not like I was holding my breath the whole time. it's just a little surreal, that's all.

what can I say, I always wanted to contribute something to the community, and this was my first big opportunity to do so. more recently I've focused in on analyzing battle sound fx with Mauron, for the same reason. They're 99% done now, but I digress...

why is Lavos there? don't get me wrong, it looks cool, but I'm not sure if that fits the meaning of the card. Lavos belongs on the Death card, not here. I still think a simple erupting volcano would fit perfectly fine. I'm sure my collaborator Syna would agree if she were around.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 22, 2018, 05:28:11 pm
why is Lavos there? don't get me wrong, it looks cool, but I'm not sure if that fits the meaning of the card. Lavos belongs on the Death card, not here. I still think a simple erupting volcano would fit perfectly fine. I'm sure my collaborator Syna would agree if she were around.
Yeah, I was actually torn with that too. At first, I wanted to add something there, so just as an illustrator I believed having Lavos falling from the sky like in the games would look cool.

....But, at the same time, I knew it probably did not fit well with the symbolism of the card itself, and in fact might disrupt it. That's why I did it on a separate layer. I'm happy to remove it, it's just a click away.

Question is, what else can I really add at that space though? Looks pretty empty IMO....  :(

Gosh darnit, where's Syna and Bekkler when you need 'em...
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on April 22, 2018, 05:35:38 pm
Quote
Question is, what else can I really add at that space though? Looks pretty empty IMO....

soaring dactyls would work, and would fit the card.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 22, 2018, 05:58:07 pm
Quote
Question is, what else can I really add at that space though? Looks pretty empty IMO....

soaring dactyls would work, and would fit the card.

Alright, here's a rough layout of the Dactyls. If this works with you, we'll keep it! If not, well, we can always try something else.

Either way, let me know. I'll pick this up again tomorrow. If this is fine, we can get started with the inking and coloring process!  8)

(https://i.imgur.com/eW2cby2.png)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: Mauron on April 22, 2018, 06:00:13 pm
It looks good with the Dactyls.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 23, 2018, 04:47:47 pm
Sorry for the delay, but... hopefully a TRULY final draft of the sketch.  8) Now I go to inking and painting.

(https://i.imgur.com/nyrfBPw.png)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: Boo the Gentleman Caller on April 23, 2018, 04:49:14 pm
Tushantin, your craft is just getting better and better. It's awesome seeing how much you've improved over the past decade or so. Proud of you, buddy! This is looking AMAZING!
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: PrincessNadia78 on April 23, 2018, 06:10:14 pm
So I showed this to my husband and he thought it was AMAZING! I love it too!

Now I will say I do feel tarot cards should be more simple, but that is only my personal opinion. Lots of detail or simple, this looks awesome!!
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 23, 2018, 06:48:28 pm
Tushantin, your craft is just getting better and better. It's awesome seeing how much you've improved over the past decade or so. Proud of you, buddy! This is looking AMAZING!

D'aww, you gonna make a grown-man blush.  :oops:

So I showed this to my husband and he thought it was AMAZING! I love it too!

Haha, sweet!
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on April 23, 2018, 07:39:16 pm
lookin good. I still think you could put an erupting volcano instead of the Reptite Lair. One concern is that if we depict Death as Lavos crashing into the Reptite Lair, it would be redundant to include it here. but it's not that big of a deal.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: PrincessNadia78 on April 23, 2018, 08:06:07 pm
I was actually thinking Magus for death, Lavos never crossed my mind! LOL I was just thinking of Magus' line "come, if it is death you seek!"
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on April 23, 2018, 08:27:35 pm
I was actually thinking Magus for death, Lavos never crossed my mind! LOL I was just thinking of Magus' line "come, if it is death you seek!"

Tarot cards have specific meanings and symbology, and quite a bit of thought has gone into synthesizing these meanings with Chrono Trigger. I'll post the thread shortly.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: Kodokami on April 24, 2018, 01:11:22 am
Wow, tush, this is looking great! I love seeing progress pics like this.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 24, 2018, 02:25:11 am
lookin good. I still think you could put an erupting volcano instead of the Reptite Lair. One concern is that if we depict Death as Lavos crashing into the Reptite Lair, it would be redundant to include it here. but it's not that big of a deal.
Both are right there in the picture, though. The volcano is right behind the Reptite lair, overshadowing it, with fire and ash-clouds coming out of it. Though, if the Reptite lair itself conflicts with the symbolism of the card, I'm happy to remove it and put something else in its place. However, I don't think it should be a big deal, since the Reptite lair will be silhouetted anyway.

What do you think?

Wow, tush, this is looking great! I love seeing progress pics like this.
Thanks, Kodo!
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on April 24, 2018, 02:35:23 am
lookin good. I still think you could put an erupting volcano instead of the Reptite Lair. One concern is that if we depict Death as Lavos crashing into the Reptite Lair, it would be redundant to include it here. but it's not that big of a deal.
Both are right there in the picture, though. The volcano is right behind the Reptite lair, overshadowing it, with fire and ash-clouds coming out of it. Though, if the Reptite lair itself conflicts with the symbolism of the card, I'm happy to remove it and put something else in its place. However, I don't think it should be a big deal, since the Reptite lair will be silhouetted anyway.

What do you think?

for some reason, my brain didn't 'see' the volcano, which should've been apparent. I see it now, and it looks good. once it's colorized it'll be unmistakable. considering the Reptite Lair is in the midst of volcanoes, it works. it's not really a conflict so there's no need to remove it.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 25, 2018, 05:38:43 pm
Just an update. Was going to share a screenshot, but then just decided to keep it a secret for now.

Currently in the inking stage, and already loving the results.

This upcoming card / art is going to be SO EPIC, I tell you. So epic that somebody might as well pay me to do this, it's that top-notch quality. But it takes so goddamned long, since I'm not trying to half-ass this (yeah, I'm the sort of person who needs to go out of my own way to "try" to half-ass something).

The only thing I'm worried about is the coloring phase. But I'll figure something out.

EDIT: 5am in the morning, and I've finally finished the inking. It looks gorgeous as balls. This is definitely worth a million bucks. Jesus Christ, the draftsmanship... Did I just fucking impress myself? That never happens! 

EDIT 2: I forgot to add the whiskers... I'll do that after I wake up. Too exhausted right now.

EDIT 3: Either way, once I'm done, I'mma print this shit for my wall.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 27, 2018, 08:39:03 am
1) Are the colors alright?
2) Should I keep going with the textured Dry Bristles brush, or should I instead go for a smooth Oil Painting effect?

I'm also kinda worried about the colors making the lines immaterial. I really loved the lines.

(https://i.imgur.com/lwA64Yi.png) (https://i.imgur.com/lwA64Yi.png)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: PrincessNadia78 on April 27, 2018, 05:28:53 pm
That is looking amazing! I also love the lines. I was going to suggest making the colors more vibrant, but I don't think it would fit. I think she's looking absolutely brilliant!

I do like the dry bristled for this, says to me "rough around the edges" which Ayla definitely is. :)
Title: DONE!! VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 28, 2018, 10:34:38 pm
DONE!  :kamina

I'm shit at Art Nouveau, but hey, at least the end result isn't that bad.  :P I like this style! I think I'll keep this style for the rest of the cards going forwards (but I'll need to be faster at producing them).

Okay, Strength card is officially done. Now i need to design the framing and templates so that I can finally publish this to Art-Station / DeviantArt and shit. And hopefully get people to subscribe to my Patreon.

Speaking of Patreon, if anybody here feels they could pitch in a bit to help me speed up the creation process by making me focus on it a bit more (rather than having to chase after clients firstly), please feel free to do so! (https://www.patreon.com/cyanlos) I won't take any money unless I actually produce something for you, so it's not a monthly payment requirement.

(https://i.imgur.com/e2XItcV.png)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: xcalibur on April 28, 2018, 11:13:46 pm
that came out very well. I approve.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: Acacia Sgt on April 28, 2018, 11:19:52 pm
Yeah, looks pretty good.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 29, 2018, 05:16:55 pm
Ah, fuck it. I'll take care of the design later. For now, click here to see the line-art, color and zoom-in run-down: https://www.artstation.com/artwork/1znK8

(I'd normally link to my own website, but for some odd reason the lightbox seems to have broken and I don't know how to fix it.)

If you don't give a shit about the run-downs and just wanna see the final image in all its glory, well, you asked for it.  :)

(https://img00.deviantart.net/e4d2/i/2018/119/4/3/timekeepers_tarot_8___strength_by_tushantin-dca5nma.jpg) (https://tushantin.deviantart.com/art/Timekeepers-Tarot-8-Strength-742654162)
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: tushantin on April 29, 2018, 06:55:50 pm
Also, I forgot I was supposed to be writing poems / write-ups for it too. Ah, well, here's something I wrote in a hurry. Posted it on my facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/cyanlos/photos/a.2324526591052496.1073741837.230368313801678/2324526617719160/?type=3&permPage=1


Quote
Gnashing teeth, volcanic roars. This fervour of beast that prowls unchecked bellows with ancient, primal energy. One would think that true strength emanates from this animalistic spirit, but upon sniffing its blind-spots it remains incomplete.

Which is why the maiden, the ultimate predator of passion, neither looses nor subdues it, nor take it upon herself to match its strength to tame the wild thing. She locks gazes with it, she touches it, she asks it. Because she understands it.

And it bows so its hungry heart can be still to accept honor, courage and sacrifice, while it also never forgets to ride ferociously knowing that to win is to live, and to lose is to die.
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: PrincessNadia78 on April 29, 2018, 09:56:19 pm
I love this so, so much!! You did a FABULOUS job! You have given me something to aspire to.  :D
Title: Re: VIII. Strength - Ayla
Post by: Boo the Gentleman Caller on April 29, 2018, 10:57:37 pm
Hey tushantin, just stopping by to tell you that this is AWESOME. A+ quality work, my friend.