Chrono Compendium
Zenan Plains - Site Discussion => Polling => Topic started by: Leebot on May 01, 2005, 11:50:31 am
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Well, it seemed logical. Sorry I'm a bit late, my internet connection refused to work yesterday for some reason. So many here, sorry if I miss your favorite, but I'm trying to list the most prominent ones.
In this case, I'm going with Gaspar.
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Cyrus. He would completely pwn gaspar in a fight.
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What an excellent poll! I had a very hard time deciding. I ruled out Schala and it came down to a duel between Spekkio and Flea, which Flea won. What can I say? Flea's an interesting one.
"Male...female...What's the difference? Power is beautiful, and I've got the Power!"
One of the most thought-provoking and provocative lines in a game filled with strong one-liners, if you ask me. I wish I knew what the original Japanese said in place of this. (Anyone care to help answer that?) =P
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I'm going with Lavos. You just can't keep a bad dog down.
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I'll have to go with a write-in candidate: Janus Zeal.
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Toma, he is the man. I want some soda (or whatever it was originally) that can summon me in a ghost form.
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Hm... Interesting. Of course, there are many choices here. However, personally, I'm going to have to say Schala for this purpose.
Why? Well, you know... Maybe it's just because I think she seems to be oppressed, and she feels like she really can't do anything, and that's how I feel sometimes.
Yes, I know it doesn't make sense, exactly. But, then again, neither do many things I say...
-Arashi
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Nah, that makes perfect sense. I got that impression too; I wanted to go in there and tell Schala that she needed to openly resist or something.
Chickenlump will pick Schala, I forecast!
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Lavos baby! You can't have a great game w/o an equally great villian. And boy did we get it with Chrono Trigger! He's one of my top tier villians of all (RPG) time. Plus, now with all the theorizing going on, people are still deciding if Lavos was really evil or if it was just going about it's own apocolyptic life-cycle. Brilliant, I say! When you find out about him, you're hooked, you want to take him down. It practically became a need for me. Plus, he was the classic several form villain
oh yeah! we beat it...wait...wtf is that? another thing?
*battle ensues*
alright! NOW it's dead...wh00t! wait? another deal?
*battle continues*
okay, that had damn well better be it, because i don't know how much longer i could take this
*ending*
per-fucking-fect-o
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Hah, don't forget the ultimate CT Fanfiction.
MAGUS : LO:ZL HAHA KRONO U ARE WEAK
MARLE: OMG LAVOS I SCOMIN
FROG: HLPEASE HELP US MAGUS
MAGUS: OH OK BUT I HAET U
LUCCA: OH GNOES LAVOS IS WPOERING UP
LAVOS: BOOMWIG
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Boomwig, indeed.
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SCHALA cuz she's my favouite NPC of any game of all time.
She has soo much power, just that we never see it. Look at how easily she could control Lavos' power to a degree by channaling it, and see how strong she was mentally and physically to fight off Lavos' power. And then we remember her sweet polite nature. To bad Kid had to come into the picture. SHE SPOILED IT ALL. FOR MY VIEW ON SCHALA AND SHE STOLE SERGE FROM LEENA! DAM HOME WRECKER!
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It's really hard to pick a favourite.
After having (finally) picked the gurus I thought of Fiona going at it by herself trying to save the forest. She's not a very important character, nor was her story particularly intricate but I liked her a lot.
(for some reason her sidequest didn't show up when I played the psx version, which was somewhat odd. The guru of time didn't mention it either but this is not the place for stuff like that)
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I had to go with Cyrus, he was pretty much Frog's whole reason for fighting. It was between him and Spekkio, I mean Spekkio gave Crono & Co the power to get the job done.
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I coulda finished the game with Cyclone & Slash...if...if I wanted...
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bah, Cyrus would cut Schala's head off. I seriously don't see whats so special about her, besides we didn't know what happend to her till CC.
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Oh puh-shaw he could. He got wasted by Magus and Schala seems more powerful than he at times. Cyrus was barely a character. He barely shows his skills anyhow (heck, even Frog is supposed to be a better swordsman, right?).
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He was considered the greatest Knight in guardia. And we dont ever see Schala use attack magic.
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Nah, that makes perfect sense. I got that impression too; I wanted to go in there and tell Schala that she needed to openly resist or something.
Chickenlump will pick Schala, I forecast!
I did indeed.
I pick her because she is powerfull, selfless, and a blue haired beauty that everyone wants to save. And if things didn't work out between us, I'd pull a Crono and try to hawk her pendant. ;)
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And we dont ever see Schala use attack magic.
Sometimes the best offence is a good defense! Har har.
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only in football.
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I voted the Three, but Schala is a near second. I most certainly think that Cyrus would be greatly outmatched by that girl. She is an ancient princess of the mightiest land that ever was, Zeal the Downfallen. In her veins burns the sorcery of the old world, forgotten in later times by such men as Cyrus. He is mighty in deeds of warcraft, no doubt, but I wager that even a girl of such a young age, being a child of the kingdom of Zeal, could bear greater injury and greater prowess in the use of arms than any knight, though he is the greatest in his age. The perilous enchantments obey her whispers, and at her call would leap forth tongues of ever-burning flame, darkness and light at once, to blind and despair any who stand before and against her power. She may be weaker than her brother in some ways, but if so not much less. Grown to full womanhood she would be mightier than even her majestic mother, and would stand tall and graceful, with the light of stars burning in her eyes, her azure hair jeweled with diamonds, like a hero-queen of the ancient world, with wisdom in her right hand, tempering the power in her left. All evil things would scatter before her, and her command would drive them to Tartaros. Hail such a queen of the ancient times, arisen in the later world to undo the ways of evil!
How much less, then, is a knight, even such a one as Cyrus, who bears the name of a mighty king of old.
Now... who liked my rant? I'm attempting to return to my favoured style of writing, and I allowed myself to become carried away. Anyone like the description?
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Hey, if Cyrus had his magical ablities unlocked by Spekkio, I be he would give Schala a run for her money. There are countless storys of simple knights defeating wizards and the like. Plus, we don't know that Schala knows any attack magic.
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Hey, if Cyrus had his magical ablities unlocked by Spekkio, I be he would give Schala a run for her money. There are countless storys of simple knights defeating wizards and the like. Plus, we don't know that Schala knows any attack magic.
On the contrary, Schala has surpassing power in sorcerous ways, even amidst her own people. No knight born of a later world could overcome her. It would be like Eomer going against Galadriel or Luthien: he is a mighty soldier, but both those women were far greater than he. The former is considered second greatest of all Elves save Feanor, and Luthien cast the court of Morgoth himself to sleep - as I'm certain you know, as you seem to know those tales very well indeed.
However, the are no stories of simple knights defeating sorcerers. In the old stories, most heroes were not exactly what one would call common: most were kings or princes, and were gifted with some great attribute or another. Sigurd bears the sword Gram when he fights the dragon, and is the last of the Volsungs, for example. Beowulf has the strength of ten men. It's not the way of old literature to make sorcerers fall to the hands of a simple knight - that's only been done recently, and the only one I can off-hand think of is Frodo bringing about the downfall of the sorcerer Sauron.
Now, as for Schala's 'attack' magic... well, one cannot look at it as though it were a video game! Techs and all that are just game representations of their innate power and strength. Schala does not have this or that skill: she has powers of sigaldry, of many different sorts, it appears. It is a mere extension of her will: if she so willed it, she could bend that power to strike down whatever she wished, I am certain. There would be no distinction between 'attack' and 'defence' magic. They are just aspects of the same, in the same way that 'Flare' and 'Fire' are inherently no different, just different manifestations of the same sorcerous power in varying forms, like the different chords of the same musical theme. The magic is an innate extension of her spirit. Her early gentleness likely kept her from any actual attack, as she did not will any harm to befall others; but later, I believe it would be very easily possible for her to strike others down. As I said, it is an extension of one's spirit, and is only bounded by the will's strength. It would be like saying someone cannot yell because it is ever their wont to whisper.
The thing is, though magic, in the Chrono world is in the games put into neat little techs and the like, that's just a game quirk. It wouldn't be like that at all! (Try writing a fanfiction with exact techs like that in it... it doesn't quite work and sound real.) The magic would be as unlimited as voice and speech, and vary even as much in degrees. There is only passing distinction, therefore, between Dark Matter and Dark Mist, even as clouds and ice are inherently the same thing, in different forms.
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Luthien didn't show any offensive capablities. In the quest of Beren and Luthien, she was protected by Beren and Huan.
Lets dismiss the idea of ordinary soldiers defeating Wizards and such, since that is just a recent consept. Cyrus was not an ordinary soldier. He was the greatest soldier of his time, the hero of his kingdom. Eomer may not be able to defeat someone like Galadriel, but Aragorn may have been able to. Anyway, that is a moot discussion. Fact is, people believed that Cyrus would defeat Magus, although Magus was too great for him and his legendary sword. Thats enough for me to grade him as a possible epic hero (not saying he is one, but if he defeated Magus, he would fit that catagory).
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*Beowulf had the strength of thirty men in each hand, not the strength of ten men.
The mechanics of Chrono Trigger introduces the concept of magic defence. Even though a warrior may not have any magical ability, his body has the innate ability to ward off the effects of magic. Call this a morphic field, if you like. A warrior of sufficient strength can sustain even the most powerful magical assaults. If Ayla were to fight Magus in 590 AD, the outcome would be by no means certain. Magus is a mortal, vulnerable to any attack of sufficient power. Cyrus didn't fail because he lacked magical ability; he did not have sufficient strength and skill to defeat Magus.
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He failed because he didnt have Crono and another magic wielding friend beside him...
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Do you think Ayla couldn't beat Magus?
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Luthien didn't show any offensive capablities. In the quest of Beren and Luthien, she was protected by Beren and Huan.
Lets dismiss the idea of ordinary soldiers defeating Wizards and such, since that is just a recent consept. Cyrus was not an ordinary soldier. He was the greatest soldier of his time, the hero of his kingdom. Eomer may not be able to defeat someone like Galadriel, but Aragorn may have been able to. Anyway, that is a moot discussion. Fact is, people believed that Cyrus would defeat Magus, although Magus was too great for him and his legendary sword. Thats enough for me to grade him as a possible epic hero (not saying he is one, but if he defeated Magus, he would fit that catagory).
For your second point, I concede that you may well be right. Cyrus may indeed be some sort of well-known hero, perhaps a tragic hero of a sort. It is never fully explained. Thus he may have greater strength than is made manifest. On that one day, however, he was caught unawares by two: Magus and Ozzie together. Even if he could have victored over one, the two overbore him. So, like I said, I will bow to you on this point regarding Cyrus, now.
But for the first one... well, you're wrong there without doubt. Firstly, as an adherer to the Tolkienesque school of fantasy, I take any sort of rule-based magic to be strange, and in CT only the effects of game mechanics. Thus someone's power cannot be classified solely into defensive and offensive. She may be better at one or the other, even as a fighter may be better at taking hits or giving them... but a fighter has fists regardless, and can at least to some degree both give and take blows.
Perhaps more importantly, though, using your defenition, you are wrong. Luthien does, on more than one occasion, use offensive magic. For your consideration:
Now chanting clearer down she cast
her long hair, till it reached at last
from her window to the darkling ground.
Men far beneath her heard the sound;
but the slumbrous strand now swung and swayed
above her guards. Their talking stayed,
they listened to her voice and fell
suddenly beneath a binding spell.
By her power she cast sleep or binding upon her Elvish guardians, and escaped them. Later, at the doors to Angband:
when, lo! a marvel to behold:
some power, descended from of old,
from race divine beyond the West,
sudden Tinuviel possessed
like inner fire. The vampire dark
she flung aside, and like a lark
cleaving through night to dawn she sprang,
while sheer, hear-piercing silver, rang
her voice, as those long trumpets keen
thrilling, unbearable, unseen
in the cold aisles of morn. Her cloak
by white hands woven, like a smoke,
like all-bewildering, all-enthralling,
all-enfolding evening, falling
from lifted arms, as forth seh stepped,
across those awful eyes she swept,
a shadow and a mist of dreams
wherein entangeld starlight gleams
And yet before the throne of Morgoth:
Down crumpled Orc, and Balrog proud;
all eyes were quenched, all heads were bowed;
the fires of heart and maw were stilled,
and ever like a bird she thrilled
above a lightless world forlorn
in ecstasy enchanted borne.
All eyes were quenched, save those that glared
in Morgoth's lowering brows, and stared,
in slowly wandering wonder round,
and slow were in enchantment bound.
Their will wavered, their fire failed,
and as beneath his brows they paled,
the Silmarils like stars were kindled
that in the reek of Earth had dwindled
excaping upwards clear to shine,
glistening marvellous in heaven's mine.
Then flaring suddenly they fell,
down, down upon the floors of hell.
The dark and mighty head was bowed;
like mountian-top beneath a cloud
the shoulders foundered, the vast form
crashed, as in overwhelming storm
huge cliffs in ruin slide and fall;
and prone lay Morgoth in his hall.
If that's not a mighty offensive power, I don't know what is. She laid low the great Dark Lord himself, the devil in his very hall.
And finally, at the bridge of Tol-Sirion:
Lo! by the brindge a gleam of light,
like stars descended from the night
to burn and tremble here below.
There wide her arms did Luthien throw,
and called aloud with voice as clear
as still at whiles may mortal hear
long elvish trumpets o'er the hill
echo, when all the world is still.
The dawn peered over mountains wan,
their grey heads silent looked thereon.
The hill trembled; the citadel
crumbled, and all its towers fell;
the rocks yawned and the bridge broke,
and Sirion spumed in sudden smoke.
Well, if that's not mighty offensive power, I don't know what is. No one else I know of, not Gandalf or even Feanor or Turgon are spoken of as wielding such overmastering power. Even faithful Finrod Felagund loses in a battle of wills against Sauron, whereas Luthien lays low even Sauron's dark master Morgoth.
And, if you mention Galadriel... well, it does say that, by the power given to her by the ring she bears, she destroys the foundations of Dul-Guldur in Mirkwood. In other words, she tears down a mighty fortress by herself. Again, such offensive power as is scarcely displayed anywhere else.
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I forgot about that last one... Okay, point conceeded, but I dont believe putting people to sleep to be an offensive ability.
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Schala. I love Schala. She's just plain awesome.
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Bah, I dont like this poll. The guru's grouped as one... And I'd bet that Schala in CC is coloring people's perception of her as a CT NPC.
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Not for me! I see her nothing like Kid: ancient, noble, high-spoken, gentle at whiles, though after her torment in the Tesseract prone to deeds of darkness as beset her mighty brother... if my earlier descriptive post did not make clear that clear. She's the tragic heroine of the Chrono series - her brother the tragic hero. On that note, though, it would then be fitting if she does indeed die forever at the end of the last game. Who knows, maybe this will be like Star Wars: everyone thinks Luke was the main character, when it turns out to be Darth Vader/Anakin. Perhaps Schala is the main character in the Chrono games, and each episode shows different portions of her life. But probably not.
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Well, some people's perception of Schala would have been colored by Kid, but I was refering to her whole ideal with the TD, and her being the reason for the game, basically.
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Someone should make a 3D Chrono Trigger fighting game so we can settle these disputes.
I agree with you Guardian, I think the Chrono Series is focused around Schala. It makes sense, she is one of a slim number of characters that appeared in both games. Both plots were wrapped around her, but she hasn't really experienced any fighting. I figure this will continue for any more games, as long as Kato is behind the helm. As fun as it would be to play with Schala, I like how she is played as the tragic heroine. Everyone agreess she is powerful, but we never get to see it fully used. The mystery is really cool.
But I still stick to my guns, Toma is really cool. The guy adventures the world looking for artifacts, and is getting hammered most of the time (I don't know what his real drink was but I know it wasn't cider). And he is intellegent too, he found the rainbow shell. If it wasn't for his obvious lack of fighting skills he would have gotten it himself. And his jokes always give me a good laugh.
You guys are a riot a minute!
Classic.
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Cyrus would cut Toma's head off.
Gotta love my Cyrus > other NPC comparisions :)
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Well, Toma is essentially, to my mind, an Indiana Jones type character, or so it seems to me. Thus Cyrus would have a little bit of a harder time than you might think - those adventurer sorts always seem to live through more than they ought to.
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Yeah, I know. Anywho, I liked Toma too, but not as much as Cyrus.
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Cyrus is cool and all, but getting whacked by Magus kinda makes him lose some of his luster. He makes Frog cooler though, which is a plus.
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I dont think there is anything wrong with a tragic hero. I mean, when William Wallace was executed, did that make you think less of him?
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Uh...yes?
*doesn't know who that is*
*does an Ashley Simpson ho-down*
Cyrus wasn't executed though. They thought they could take Magus down. Cyrus was wrong...dead wrong! Mwah ha ha! Get it? He died...and he was wrong...or something...?
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William Wallace...? Brave Heart...? You know, that Mel Gibson movie, based on the Scotish hero? His army mooned the evil english, and big battles and stuff? Since I'm about to spoil the movie for you, you best surrender now, and stop reading.
Near the end, the English ambush him at a friendly city, and take him to London for painful execution.
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Oh right...Yeah, I've seen Braveheart (hasn't everyone?)...The Patriot was a super Braveheart rip-off...
Whenever I think of Braveheart, I think of The Crusible or something when he says all a man has is his name...or something
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My vote goes for Schala....
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Not for me! I see her nothing like Kid: ancient, noble, high-spoken, gentle at whiles, though after her torment in the Tesseract prone to deeds of darkness as beset her mighty brother... if my earlier descriptive post did not make clear that clear. She's the tragic heroine of the Chrono series - her brother the tragic hero. On that note, though, it would then be fitting if she does indeed die forever at the end of the last game. Who knows, maybe this will be like Star Wars: everyone thinks Luke was the main character, when it turns out to be Darth Vader/Anakin. Perhaps Schala is the main character in the Chrono games
In a way, she is on the main character throughout the series.
I don't know how many have realized that.
Her stroy is very tragic and sad.
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And a small quote regarding her fate.... ;)
"Long ago, in a far off kingdom, lived a girl.
Because of her power, the kingdom had come to an end, crumbling under its own weight.
Many became engulfed in the temporal vortex that was created, never to be heard from again...
...But not the girl. She lived on, enduring a much sadder fate...
Running from her past and fearing her future, she wanted nothing more than to be swallowed up in the surging waves of the vortex of time...
Hating what she'd done, refusing what she'd said or heard, to simply continue living was her curse.
But the stone, It had other plans for her...
Turning back the hands of her clock, scattering her memories,
she was granted another chance.
Since the precious stone was in her possession,
she carried with her all its will and power.
And so, she was born into this era,
returning to reality as a mere infant... "
~ Radical Dreamers ~
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As great as Schala is, Lavos is just as, or more, important. And when it comes down to it, how could I NOT vote for a big alien incarnation of destruction?
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Cyrus's death was not nearly as noble or awesome as any legendary hero. He got busted by Magus easily and really did nothing beside beat up some helpless frog to get the Hero Medal. Thats all that was shown to us at least. Obviously he did something great to be able to head the Knights of the Square Table, but I gotta see it to believe his greatness.
Toma does everything he intends to do, and if he could fight he might have been able to get out of the cave alive. He knew about the Queen in the Catherdral before anyone else. And Marle said he was her type, so he has to be a pimp. Well maybe not a pimp, but he's got enough game to make a Princess like him.
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Schala.
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Feh. Schala is overrated. Despite her delusional-ness, Flea is teh awesomeness.
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For some reason I wish Fiona was up there >_>. IF it was a choice between Fiona and Schala it would be tough. I personally like fiona because of her extra animations and stuff and same with schala. And you say Cyrus can cut her head off, but considering she was gifted with magic she could zap him as he's coming so basically.
Cyrus: zomfg imscomming!
Schala: -ZAP-
Cyrus: -dies-
What an ending to a great story
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I'm for the Gurus. They are definitely Sage-like and they're the ones who put the whole save-the-world plan together.
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I pick Schala as my favorite NPC... She has this myterious charm that got my attention.
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I would pick Schalla...