Chrono Compendium
Enhasa Halls - Chrono Series Analysis => Time, Space, and Dimensions => Topic started by: Zaulche on June 02, 2008, 02:28:26 pm
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I originally read this in the thread The Pendant and the Telepod (http://www.chronocompendium.com/Forums/index.php/topic,5156.0.html) but did not want to comment there since it was off topic. It was noted in the thread that another thread had been started dealing with some of these issues but I was unable to find it, so I apologize in advance if this topic has already been discussed.
In the thread mentioned above the following was stated:
Dimension-0 better fits as a geometric point, a location lacking depth, width, and length but still existing. When one doesn't consider time to be the 4th dimension (especially as it would be the only dimension to necessitate movement), it gets placed on a separate dimensional scale. Instead of time being the 4th dimension, we could say that there are 3 (or more) spatial dimensions and 1 (or more) temporal dimensions.
The DBT could exist entirely on the spatial dimensional scale and not the temporal dimensional scale; however that causes a problem for Time Bastard Theory (which doesn't mean either theory is inherently wrong, but that they are in conflict); if the DBT helps preserve matter (so that it is neither created nor destroyed due to Time Travel causing new time lines), it would seemingly have no appreciable length, width, depth, etc. The only thing that would exist there is information (as likewise, information cannot be destoryed; see the Information Paradox). This is curious as it would seemingly not exist on either dimensional scale then (though possibly still being a geometric point, yet if it is a geometric point containing only information, it would be quite similar to a black hole itself).
Would this mean that the DBT could be viewed as a 0th dimensional existence? Are Black Holes considered 0th dimensional objects? I never thought of either as such, but it would seem to fit the description, at least at face value. Is there more to what makes up a 0th dimension than what has already been mentioned?
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Since the DBT "exists" (stretching it's definition, really) beyond time, it's really more of a -0 dimension...No, not really, but you see how stupid it is to just affix something that really doesn't belong on a zero? :P
0th dimension looks and sound stupid, sorry...
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Sort of like the Zeroth Law of Robotics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_laws_of_robotics#Zeroth_Law_added). You can blame Asimov, but the 0th (0st? 0nd? 0rd?) dimension is an actual physics concept. See Zero-Dimension Space (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-dimensional_space) or a gemetric point (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Point_%28geometry%29).
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0th dimension looks and sound stupid, sorry...
No need to be sorry. I understand if the label itself sounds silly, I was more referring to the concept that the label identifies.
Perhaps there is another label we can give to the 0D concept. There are already a lot of acronyms floating around the site, one more would probably not hurt.
Idrian10, I had trouble understanding what you were trying to say. Would you care explain it differently or take another stab at it altogether?
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Since the DBT "exists" (stretching it's definition, really) beyond time, it's really more of a -0 dimension...No, not really, but you see how stupid it is to just affix something that really doesn't belong on a zero? :P
0th dimension looks and sound stupid, sorry...
The DBT is a Tesseract, the tesseract is a 4th dimensional cube and is one inside another:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesseract (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesseract)
so I supose that DBT is inside or aoutside the dimentions.
But I am not really sure...
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Idrian10, thanks, I understood that more. It is something to think about. I'll give a more thoughtful reply after I dwell on it.
MagilsugaM, How do you know for certain that the DBT is a tesseract? While I find the possibility as intriguing as 0d space, I thought what exactly it is was still under discussion. Perhaps I missed something vital in the previous discussion about this.
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The DBT is a Tesseract, the tesseract is a 4th dimensional cube and is one inside another:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesseract (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesseract)
so I supose that DBT is inside or aoutside the dimentions.
Perhaps I missed it, but how do we know the DBT is a tesseract?
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We DON'T know that it's a Tessaract, but that's been a popular Chrono theory. I think it was YOU, Thought, that proposed it was counter-time? Since having read that theory I've been quite keen to the concept of Counter-Time being some form of counter-time. It would make sense considering the Counter-Time Experiment and some of the qualifying physics that seem to exist in the Chronoverse.
However, I don't know as much about that as some, so I allow it to be debated if need be.
My only question with the DBT as counter-time is how would anything EXIST and SURVIVE in Counter-Time?
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We DON'T know that it's a Tessaract, but that's been a popular Chrono theory. I think it was YOU, Thought, that proposed it was counter-time?
Really? Well, it wouldn't be the first time I've proposed something only to come to the exact opposite conclusion later and not remember ever having thought differently. It makes for some interesting arguments with my friends, sometimes. "Why in the world would you think that?" "Me? You were the one who suggested it!" "Really? Well then, why in the world did I think that?"
But so the DBT may or may not be a Tessaract... actually, looking at the game script, we really know almost nothing about the DBT. It is only called the "Darkness Beyond Time" once (by ghost Marle); it is usually termed as being beyond the "dimensional void" or on the other side of the "dimensional darkness" by Belthasar (and I think those are the only two people who even mention it). Perhaps we've fundamentally misunderstood what the DBT is? This might require an intensive and exhausting analysis of the game script, interviews, and old threads.
... I don't suppose you also remember what I (or whoever) meant by it being "counter-time"? Is counter-time being used as a specific object or form of energy? Or what thread this was in? I'm interested in seeing what I said about it, and what other's said.
My only question with the DBT as counter-time is how would anything EXIST and SURVIVE in Counter-Time?
Well, if we take the phrase "counter-time" at literal face value, it is a simple matter of surviving and existing. There is no reason (that I am aware of at least) that the arrow of time has to point in one direction only; that it has to point "forward." If it pointed backwards, well things would just have an origin in the future and a demise in the past, one would grow younger with age, etc. Strange from our perspective, but it would appear, internally, exactly like our direction of time… just… not.
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Well then maybe it WASN'T you, Though, hahaha...
I will try to find that thread information sometime soon.
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That theory, I read it in the Chrono wiki. But it wasn't from Thought.
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Here...
http://www.chronocompendium.com/Forums/index.php/topic,2299.0.html
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Thanks, dankun. Now I want people to read it and think about it.
That includes, you, Thought!
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Thanks, dankun. Now I want people to read it and think about it.
That includes, you, Thought!
Sir! Yes, Sir!
Ah, the good ol PT&DT article. I am still not sure if I correctly understand TTI, Time Bastard, or if I even agree with either. It is unfortunately that Mr. Nerd Hair never came back after that one post; it was quite interesting. So... what was the question again?
Oh yes.
1) Is the DBT essentially a geometric point (a 0th dimension, having no length, width, depth, timeth, dimensionth, etc)?
2) Is the DBT a tesseract (which would probably negate it being a geometric point)?
Of course, these are really just particular manifestations of a larger, metaquestion:
What is the Darkness Beyond Time?
That is the question that is like a splinter in our minds, driving us mad.
Anywho, Mr. Hair there supposed that the DBT is just Time Error Past. A very interesting theory, particular as it seems to fit in well with the Counter Time experiment. However, he was incorrect in that in order to travel into Time Error past one would need to suppose a higher dimension, a Time Error-Error. One of the great mysteries of time is why it only flows in one direction. There is no reason for it; one should be able to travel in both directions along a dimensional axis (either hither and thither for length, left or right for width, up or down for depth, ana or kata for spissitude, etc).
To note... essentially, Serge is a dreg from the DBT as well (as least, when he is in Another World). He's dead and buried, but alive and well there.
However, it would seem that the DBT can't just be time error past, see:
History is composed of
choices and divergences.
Each choice you make
creates a new world and
brings forth a new future.
But at the same time,
you're eliminating a
different future with the
choices you didn't make.
A future denied of all
existence because of a
change in the past...
A future that was destroyed
even before it was born
rests here...condensed
into the Dead Sea.
At that very moment,
this whole future time
axis ceased to exist.
It isn't that the Apocalypse future merely exists on an unperceivable time-error coordinate, it is that it doesn't exist at all (yet it is existing, which is a bit of a conundrum).
But as I said in a prior post, our understanding of the Darkness Beyond Time is very limited and potentially flawed.
Let see, what do we have from the script that might refer to the DBT (to note, the name "Darkness Beyond Time" is only used once):
This lost future is about to
disappear into the darkness
beyond the dimensions again...
You have no time to spare.
You must leave here
immediately!
Quick...go!
The actual Dragon God
was consumed long ago,
in the distant past...
Integrated by the entity
known as Lavos in a time
on the other side of the
dimensional darkness.
The Devourer of Time
is a new life-form...
Born out of the fusion of a
life-form from this planet with
Lavos, who nests on the far
side of the dimensional void.
In the darkness that exists
on the other side of time,
Schala has been integrated
with the Devourer of Time!
A new species is about to be
born on this planet -- an
alien life-form even more
evolved than the old Lavos!
At the darkness beyond time,
the weakened Schala came under
the influence of Lavos, and
the two became one entity.
The final gate, which leads
to the darkness of time...
Looks like this is finally it...
Note, every single character says almost the exact same thing when you access that final gate; they all call it the "darkness of time," not "the Darkness Beyond Time." Specifically, I've confirmed that this is said by: Guile, Norris, Nikki, Viper, Riddel, Karsh, Zoah, Marcy, Korcha, Luccia, Razzly, Zappa, Orcha, Radius, Fargo, Macha, Glenn, Leena, Miki, Janice, Sprigg, Draggy, Starky, Mojo/y, Turnip, NeoFio, Greco, Skelly, Funguy, Irenes, Mel, Leah, Van, Sneff, Steena, Doc, Grobyc, Pierre, Orlha, Pip, and of course, Kid. The only one who doesn't call it the Darkness of Time is Poshul. Even the system itself calls is the "Darkness of Time" when it gives you a choice to enter or not.
So, the "DBT" (which seems to be a rather odd name to call it, given that the game doesn't call it that very often) seems to be a "darkness" that is "beyond the dimensions," it is a place on the "other side of the dimensional darkness" and on the far side of the "dimensional void," and it is a "darkness" that exists on the other side of "time."
Well, as the "darkness" aspect of the DBT is fairly constant, a few quotes about “Darkness” being something tangible might be called for:
The mist of the sea
is an invitation to the dark...
Embracing the abyssmal darkness,
where the lost souls gather...
Hmmm...
Are you really a human who does
not exist in this world...?
You are now drifting between
the boundaries of life and
death...
You are too young to be taken
into the arms of darkness.
Romana, you are still too
young to take on such a
task!
The spirits are always
looking for a chance to
draw the living into the
darkness!
I am the sister of Ghetz...
A small thing now and then
won't get me down.
This time, you must save
this one from the darkness...
I think Ghetz desires that, also.
Yes, I was once possessed
by the '"darkness"'...
Back then, I entered the ring
and did as I pleased to fulfill
my appetite for destruction.
I know I lost my sanity
because of that sword...
But I must admit, the sword
is not entirely to blame.
I was jealous of Garai...
I wanted to be the better
swordsman.
The once renowned Masamune...
'"The Holy Sword That
Conquered Darkness."'
Could it be merely a
tool for murder...?
While these quotes don't specifically refer to the DBT, it seems that both the DBT and these quotes are referring to a darkness that exists beyond normal reality. One will note that all such lines refer basically to death and destruction, the essence of the Time Devourer (and indeed, Lavos).
A few lines regarding Schala actually might give us a good idea of where the DBT is (emphasis added):
The true beginning was during
the destruction of the ancient
Kingdom of Zeal!
As the palace collapsed around
her, Princess Schala was sucked
into a dimensional vortex along
with the Lavos Mammon Machine.
Schala and Lavos became unified
into one even more powerful
entity that would evolve into
the Devourer of Time.
Filled with the hatred and
sadness of Lavos, half of
Schala's mind became set on
destroying all of existence.
Yet at the same time, the
other half of her mind
desired to save the universe
and to be rescued herself.
As Schala fell through the
time gate in this condition,
she heard your crying
echoing through time...
"As"! As Schala fell through the gate, Lavos began absorbing her. Yet, Lavos began absorbing her in the DBT. If both are true, then it is the space between a gate's entry point and exit point that is the DBT (but as the gates don't travel any physical distance, that space isn't a proper dimension).
This certainly fits with the DBT being "beyond time;" that corridor doesn't exist in any proper time, not even the End of Time (and possibly not even Time Error applies properly there). It is also the perfect "0th" dimension, as the Chronopolis scientists talk about the Time Egg using a gravitational singularity to connect two points in time. What is a gravitational singularity but a geometric (0th dimension) point?
Now, because I can, does everyone recall what Marle said, in Chrono Trigger, after she returns from being removed from time? Either the Entity did it or the grand father paradox did it, but she was removed from the normal flow of time (which presumably means, she was sent to the DBT). She compared that “Darkness” to death!
But anywho, that is just my current interpretation of the quotes regarding the "DBT" based off the quotes. What are other people's interpretations?
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Gosh, Thought, I love you.
So in essence the DBT is absolutely nothing.
Of course, I have this theory that involves the Crypts of Time and whatnot, but thats totally non-canon and moreso ties in with the fangame/fanfiction I have in mind.
In Phillip Pullman's His Dark Materials trilogy he talks about the 'space' between worlds (dimensions) and the spectre-like beings that exist there. I sort of see the DBT in a similar light. Reading my post won't make sense, though. You have to have read the books to understand what I'm talking about.
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Interesting. So if the varying branches from all of our decisions create parallels with the unchosen path being discarded in the DBT, does that mean that everyone relates to the same DBT, or is the DBT relative to the individual observing their reality?
It would seem to me to be relative. In Chrono Cross there are two dimensions branching at one point in Serge's life. However, these are just two branches focused on because they were important to the particular timeline. In reality there are an infinite number of branches. Just like there were instances of the same person in each timeline, there would be an infinite number of instances of people in the universe across these dimensions.
Also, what makes someone's consciousness stay with a particular instance over another (why do I exist with my given life path instead of another)?
More questions, but hopefully in understanding this I can get a better idea of just what the DBT is and is not.
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I sorta picture the DBT as a 0-dimensional location and a dissociation of the fabrical form of reality(i.e. the given dimensional perspective). To put this in application, when entity A, 'bound' to the fabric of time, becomes dislodged by another(entity B) taking the exact location of entity A, the entity becomes a floating point above the fabric, such that it's existence becomes ethereal or 'unbound' from the current dimensional perspective. Taking this into consideration(Thought, if you don't mind I'm going to adapt your theory to be compatible with mine.) when a gate is 'opened', one could envision the 'fabric' of reality 'folding' to join two non-contiguous points forming a connection(i.e. a gate). To 'thicken' the plot, so to speak: what happens when a pre-existing point lies between two ends of a gate and something(say a person, for instance) passes through? The two entities would, theoretically, 'share' the same imaginary coordinate and, thus, become one merged being. Perhaps this is what happened with the Time Devourer merger.
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Sorry to jump in here w/o reading very much of the thread, but I read talk of the Tesseract, and wanted to make sure everyone knows that this is apparently the name of the DBT in the Japanese script:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/file/196917/8578
EDIT: Interesting, the Bend of Time was originally "Ultima Thule." I don't have a clue what that means, but it sounds particularly kickass.
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Sorry to jump in here w/o reading very much of the thread, but I read talk of the Tesseract, and wanted to make sure everyone knows that this is apparently the name of the DBT in the Japanese script:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/file/196917/8578
EDIT: Interesting, the Bend of Time was originally "Ultima Thule." I don't have a clue what that means, but it sounds particularly kickass.
I found something about it is like the "Ultimate thule" means beyond the "borders of the unknow world"
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thule (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thule)
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According to the "Chrono Cross J-E Dictionary", the Bend of Time is "次元の狭間" in the Japanese version.
Google translate translated it as "- Dimensional vulnerabilities"
* 次元 【じげん】 (n) (1) dimension; (2) perspective; point of reference; level (of something); (P); EP
* 狭間 【はざま】 (n) (1) interval; (2) valley; gorge; ravine; (3) loophole; eyelet; ED
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Interesting, I wonder how Elranzer came up with Ultima Thule? It sorta fits with the definition as presented by MagilsugaM, being an island that is inaccessible during a non-New Game+ playthrough, and thus could be interpreted as "beyond the known world." To be perfectly accurate, Elranzer listed it as Ultima Thule of Time.
If the Bend of Time is a place of "Dimensional Vulnerabilities," its nature may be related to Angelus Errare (entrance point to the DBT?), the entrance/exit point to/from Sprigg's whacked-out dimensional home, and the Dead Sea. Come to think of it, could all these places be labeled an Angelus Errare? El Nido seems to be littered with dimensional disturbances.
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I don't know if "dimensional vulnerabilities" is accurate. Another translation site gave "interval of dimension". If it matters, I searched for the Japanese term and one of the things it was used to refer to something in FFV; I think the official translation's term is "Cleft of Dimension".
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"Cleft of Dimension" makes perfect sense, because that's the name of the Bend of Time theme on the OST, or at least how it's been translated into English.
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In Phillip Pullman's His Dark Materials trilogy he talks about the 'space' between worlds (dimensions) and the spectre-like beings that exist there. I sort of see the DBT in a similar light. Reading my post won't make sense, though. You have to have read the books to understand what I'm talking about.
Actually, I was thinking of the same thing (Pullman's "windows").
For those who haven't read the books, essentiall a "window" is a lot like the dimensional distortion in CC. It connects one world with "another" world in which there are fundamental differences. Perhaps there is just a social difference, perhaps evolution happened slightly differently, perhaps the laws of physics are slightly different (allowing one's "Spirit" to manifest itself in the real world), etc.
A window technically is only a two dimensional object; it has length and width but no depth. Yet, at the same time, the two worlds don't perfectly touch; there is a definable spot where one ends and the other begins. In that spot, the space between existances, there is nothing. It doesn't technically exist, yet it is a "something" that separates the worlds.
Thus to tie this back to Chrono, the passage between a gate's two ends doesn't really exist in any manner that is easily understandable. It is the void between this world and the next, where things can pass through but don't really exist.
The space between dimensions. There's all sorts of realities around us, different dimensions, billions of parallel universes all stacked up against each other. The Void is the space in between, containing absolutely nothing. Can you imagine that, nothing? No light, no dark, no up, no down, no life.... no time.... without end. My people called it "the Void", the Eternals call it "the Howling", but some people call it Hell. (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenth_Doctor#Army_of_Ghosts_.5B2.12.5D)
Sorry to jump in here w/o reading very much of the thread, but I read talk of the Tesseract, and wanted to make sure everyone knows that this is apparently the name of the DBT in the Japanese script:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/file/196917/8578
Brilliant Faust! This helps underline the importance and ultimate need for a CC retranslation.
If the Japanese version calls it a Tesseract, then that is very strong evidence indeed that it is a tesseract. But, unfortunately, does anyone know how accurate that translation is? What I mean is, is the Japanese word just one that could be translated as "Tesseract" or is the meaning much more fixed? As Vehek pointed out, that FAQ's interpretation of the Japanese meaning of Bend of Time being "the Ultimate Thule of Time" isn't a perfect translation. Thus, is Tesseract a good or debateable translation as well?
That FAQ is terribly interesting(particularly in the alternate translation of the Dragon God Time Devourer being "Lunar Dragon" or the Astral Amulet being a "Medicine Bag"), but I am unclear on how good and firm all its translations are. (And some of the NA translations are better than the originals; Doll Clay is pretty mundane, but Terrator is fun).
Interesting, I wonder how Elranzer came up with Ultima Thule? It sorta fits with the definition as presented by MagilsugaM, being an island that is inaccessible during a non-New Game+ playthrough, and thus could be interpreted as "beyond the known world." To be perfectly accurate, Elranzer listed it as Ultima Thule of Time.
If the Bend of Time is a place of "Dimensional Vulnerabilities," its nature may be related to Angelus Errare (entrance point to the DBT?), the entrance/exit point to/from Sprigg's whacked-out dimensional home, and the Dead Sea. Come to think of it, could all these places be labeled an Angelus Errare? El Nido seems to be littered with dimensional disturbances.
But one can access the Bend of Time in a non-New Game+ playthrough. Though it is rather random place that doesn't fit in well with the rest of the game, making it fit rather nicely still with being "beyond the known world."
Also, the Angelus Errare may or may not lead to the DBT. It depends on if all of Opassa Beach is the AE or just the distortion between the worlds. If the latter, then the DBT is accessed from a different portal. But if all dimensional distortions (including the one in the Hydra Marshes) can be termed Angelus Errare, then that would make sense. Unfortunately the game isn't terribly specific on this.
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I couldn't find direct equivalents to Marle's and Lucca's lines about "darkness" in a Japanese site with dialog from Chrono Cross.
The dialog option to go to the "Darkness of Time" is "時の闇の彼方へ！"
- 時 【とき】 (n-adv,n) (1) time; hour; (2) occasion; moment; (P); EP
- 闇 【やみ】 (n,adj-no) darkness; the dark; black-marketeering; dark; shady; illegal; (P); EP
- 彼方 【あちら】 (n) (1) (uk) that way; over there; yonder; (2) that one; that; (3) (pol) that person; (4) foreign country (esp. a Western nation); (P); EP
Unless it picked completely wrong words, I don't think this even comes close to "Tesseract".
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Perhaps we should try getting in touch with Elranzer and see how he came up with "Tesseract," seeing as it's so important to the theorization here.
If it helps any, the BGM music for the DBT is translated as "Into a Time of Darkness" on the Playstation Sound Format version of the OST I've got. However, when I compare the kanji on the OST liner notes to what Vehek posted, the symbols are not the same as the ones used in-game.
Seeing as "Ultima Thule" and "Tesseract" are *so* far away from what Vehek is getting for these places, I'm wondering if it was the Ultimania Guide or an interview with Kato or something that Elranzer was looking at.
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This question I feel is related to the argument of the DBT: what is the dimensional void where Sprigg lives? Are they connected at all? Through quantum mechanics? Through other means? Or not at all?
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Tesseract it could be right one. I have a theory the 0th dimension is the inside one of the tesseract consuming pace and time of the other 2 dimensions.
Like this image shows. It could be also two tesseract consuming.
One the Home world and the other consuming the Another world.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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So you can have an unlimited number of tesseracts linked together?
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Yes that one is a 5th dimentional cube.
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But that would be a hypercube (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cube_2:_Hypercube), not a tesseract, wouldn't it? (seeing as a tesseract specifically refers to a 4D hypercube).
The entire problem with the DBT being a tesseract (or a hypercube) is... well... the great repository of discarded timelines, from which The Time Devourer will reach out and bring death and destruction, is just a fancy box. It seems rather anticlimatic. A higher dimension in general I can understand, but a fancy box?
In the words of the immortal Kuni (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UHF_%28film%29):
"You took the box! Let's see what's in the box! ... Nothing! Absolutely nothing! STUPID!"
Still, that might be the way it is.
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Could "tesseract" refer merely to the entrance to the DBT, and not the DBT itself? I keep thinking of "tesseract" in the sense that it was used in A Wrinkle in Time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Wrinkle_in_Time#Plot_summary), where it was apparently a fold in space-time. I wonder if Elranzer was translating "Angelus Errare" and not the DBT, which can be easily mixed up...
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But that would be a hypercube (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cube_2:_Hypercube), not a tesseract, wouldn't it? (seeing as a tesseract specifically refers to a 4D hypercube).
The entire problem with the DBT being a tesseract (or a hypercube) is... well... the great repository of discarded timelines, from which The Time Devourer will reach out and bring death and destruction, is just a fancy box. It seems rather anticlimatic. A higher dimension in general I can understand, but a fancy box?
In the words of the immortal Kuni (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UHF_%28film%29):
"You took the box! Let's see what's in the box! ... Nothing! Absolutely nothing! STUPID!"
Still, that might be the way it is.
But also ccould be located at the start of time not at the end like in End of time.
Before the big bang pure nothingness...
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I keep thinking of "tesseract" in the sense that it was used in A Wrinkle in Time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Wrinkle_in_Time#Plot_summary), where it was apparently a fold in space-time.
Looking over that wiki-summary, A Wrinkle in Time seems like it actually shares a few plot simularities with the Chrono Series. But that aside, I also like the idea of "tesseract" being used more metaphorically than literally.
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I wonder if Elranzer was translating "Angelus Errare" and not the DBT, which can be easily mixed up...
http://www006.upp.so-net.ne.jp/meeres/t_ccw6.htm
預言者
「そうした分岐をおこすような場所は、
天使の迷う場所と呼ばれている。
A prophet
"a place from which such branch is started is called the place whose angel wavers..
I've also put Alf/Guile's line at Opasa Beach through a machine translator. Right now, it looks like the Japanese name is just the "Where Angels Lose Their Way".
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Fascinating. Time to send Elranzer an email, if the one listed in his translation FAQ still works. I'll get on that soon. I'm extremely curious about the usage of "tesseract" and "Ultima Thule" now.
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I think the nature of the Darkness has to do with something that the developers conveniently forgot to explain that ties together a lot of loose ends in this game, such as the huge WTF moment that was the Dead Sea.